Its All About Business - Focus 2008

[gonzo]

This year I would like for this boards focus to expand by seriously keeping these few questions in mind.

1. Why do sponsors fuck you and what is the methodology they use to cheat you out of money and/or traffic.

2. How can you as an affiliate differentiate yourself from the hobbyists that behave like flock of sheep to earn beer money?

3. Why do your conversions suck / how do you fix it / when do you FIRE a sponsor?

Also

On January 4th we will be expanding our focus to include the legal challenges that face each of us. With the recent armchair lawyers posting outlandish claims as fact and the rumors of threatening lawsuits I figure its time that Oprano steps up to the challenge as a credible source for these issues.

Join us Jan 4th for more information on this and thru the year in 2008 as we swing into think tank mode to tackle the aforementioned questions.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Also

On January 4th we will be expanding our focus to include the legal challenges that face each of us. With the recent armchair lawyers posting outlandish claims as fact and the rumors of threatening lawsuits I figure its time that Oprano steps up to the challenge as a credible source for these issues.

.

Here Hear!

[tony404]

sounds great

[bluemoney]

Sounds like some carry over talk from the BW dinner.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

Sounds like some carry over talk from the BW dinner.

Some of us weren't invited to "dinner."

First, no donuts, now, no dinner.

I get no respect.....never got a dinner...

[Toby]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Some of us weren't invited to "dinner."

First, no donuts, now, no dinner.

I get no respect.....never got a dinner...

You could've hitched a ride with Abe.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by Toby

You could've hitched a ride with Abe.

Unless I'm mistaken......a REALLY long ride?

[Toby]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Unless I'm mistaken......a REALLY long ride?

I'm sure if you'd asked nicely the Sausage King of Chicago would have swung by PA on his way and picked you up.

[Hell Puppy]

The whole adult internet economic system is broken.

The real question is how do you fix it? Or perhaps first, CAN it be fixed?

The business is based upon providing fantasy, and that applies to business to business as well as to the surfers unfortunately. In other words, those who play best are usually good bullshit artists. Just as you convince the surfer they are going to have an online relationship with a hottie on webcam, you convince the webmaster who sent him there that you can pay him $70 for a free sign up.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg, we wont even talk about the interesting things that seem to happen to conversion rates around the time of big shows.

Why does this happen? Are people inherently thieves in the business? I'd say it's more about market position. Run a company on the up and up and dont provide insane PPS rates, and you're either going to have to generate a lot of your own traffic or stay small-ish. There are good livings to be made this way. Perhaps the real answer is greed.

Someone else gets fucked here. While trying to pay these rates, garner as much traffic as possible, and shore up margins the surfer gets dicked around. Blind cross-sells, Zango, and all of the other things we do to ring every last dollar out of that poor clod who actually pulled out his credit card to buy something from us. He gets fucked. He charges back. We lose a would be customer from the pool permanently and give Visa ammunition to make it even harder for us to process a single penny.

So what's a webmaster to do if he wants to be an affiliate and make an honest buck or two?

It's new years, I'll give a few bits of advice:

• Know your traffic. Know your surfers, where they come from and what they're looking for. Match them to sponsors which will deliver exactly that.
• Measure your traffic yourself. Know how much you send to a program dont trust their numbers, trust your own.
• Try multiple sponsors.
• Pay per click, pay per signup, prepaid, pay per impression, revshare, all of these words are irrelevent. The only number that matters is the one that is on the check. Choose your sponsors based on who pays the most for the same amount of traffic, this is why it is important you measure the amount yourself.
• Choose your businss partners wisely. If they poison your traffic, your surfer will never trust your recommendation again. They may never trust anything adult again.
• Watch your stats, know your trends. If your traffic is up and from same sources you always use, but suddenly the sponsors reported number of signups drops 50% a month after a show when his credit card bills arrive, you might wanna have a chat or drop him.

When to drop a sponsor is a very tricky question as that is ideally a business relationship question. One short check may not be that bad if the checks are much higher than other sponsors on a year to year basis. Even a late or missing check, mistakes can happen. But for me the point I dump is when trust is broken.

[Hell Puppy]

I will say one thing about the boards. The value of information presented on most boards has decreased dramatically over the last decade.

In the early days, circa 1997-1999, the scammers were well known on the boards, busted out quickly and only the uninformed would use them.

Now the misinformation and bullshit creates so much noise that it is not very easy to gleam the nuggets. On a board like gfy it is near impossible. This is one of the hidden values of oprano. If you learn to read the tea leaves here, you can still see a lot of things coming for the 3-6 months while it is denied vehemently on other boards.

Elsewhere say something bad about a sponsor and every body he's bought a drink for at the last show will pile on and say "oh no, no way, he's top notch!".

Myself, I sleep better saying what I mean, meaning what I say. Even if it's unpopular with people who could probably throw a few dollars my way. But hey, I have been here over 10 years now, I generate my own traffic, rely on a select few business partners. Anything else is just gravy. It allows me a freedom I enjoy.

And hey, I can afford my own drinks and also dont need to whore a free dinner off anyone in Vegas.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by Toby

I'm sure if you'd asked nicely the Sausage King of Chicago would have swung by PA on his way and picked you up.

Yep.....LONG ride....12 hours from Chicago to here (Did that one, once.....once.)
Then another 8-10 to atlanta?


Wooooo....weeee........better be a damn good dinner.

[KevinG]

This is a great post and I am glad to hear it.

Great response from Hell Puppy too.

As to the first question:

1. Why do sponsors fuck you and what is the methodology they use to cheat you out of money and/or traffic.

The answer partly lies in question number 2.

The sponsors know that most of the affiliates are easy to screw over becasue they are ...

hobbyists that behave like flock of sheep to earn beer money

and finally ...

3. Why do your conversions suck / how do you fix it / when do you FIRE a sponsor?

My answer to all three is to follow what Hell Puppy said, and then when you find out which programs work best and you have some earned dollars under your belt, contact the higher-ups at the sponsor personally and directly.

Tell them you want to find ways to work more closely together and increase sales for both of you.

There are always things we can use as webmaster affiliates to improve our content, traffic and conversions.

But first, you must address Gonzo's question number 2 and DIFFERENTIATE yourself by actually earning commissions that go beyond "beer money".

You know the old saying "money talks and bullshit walks".

Prove to a sponsor that you are worth working with and that they shouldn't treat you like the rest of the flock.

[WebBilling.com]

There will be some excellent discussion here. I better prepare for Friday.

Donuts...Dinner? I wasn't invited either EJ - I guess we'll have to get into the city more

[bluemoney]

Originally Posted by KevinG

This is a great post and I am glad to hear it.

Great response from Hell Puppy too.

As to the first question:



The answer partly lies in question number 2.

The sponsors know that most of the affiliates are easy to screw over becasue they are ...



and finally ...



My answer to all three is to follow what Hell Puppy said, and then when you find out which programs work best and you have some earned dollars under your belt, contact the higher-ups at the sponsor personally and directly.

Tell them you want to find ways to work more closely together and increase sales for both of you.

There are always things we can use as webmaster affiliates to improve our content, traffic and conversions.

But first, you must address Gonzo's question number 2 and DIFFERENTIATE yourself by actually earning commissions that go beyond "beer money".

You know the old saying "money talks and bullshit walks".

Prove to a sponsor that you are worth working with and that they shouldn't treat you like the rest of the flock.

Good stuff Kevin.

[bluemoney]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Some of us weren't invited to "dinner."

First, no donuts, now, no dinner.

I get no respect.....never got a dinner...

It was an open invitation . . . hell even Buckwheat was there and he lives in a cardboard box discarded from a local Poultry Plant.

[Hell Puppy]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

It was an open invitation . . . hell even Buckwheat was there and he lives in a cardboard box discarded from a local Poultry Plant.

And he said the fried green maters were oooooooootttaaayyyy!