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Old 03-20-2004   #1
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sign at protest in NYC
hmmm
what an idea
hey you republicans
how about it?
money for jobs and ed.
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Old 03-21-2004   #2
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I suppose you think that Bush has put no money towards education and made no effort to create or encourage the creation of jobs.
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Old 03-21-2004   #3
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Meni,

Federal spending on education under Bush has increased 65%. It is commonly said he has never met a spending bill he didn't like.

There are 5 million more people employed in the US today than there were 4 years ago. You can look up those numbers at the Department of Labor website.

January, 2004. 138.6 million employed.
1999. 133.4 million employed.

Unemployment is below its post 1960's average right now. What would you consider good unemployment numbers? I think 5.6% is more than reasonable.
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Old 03-21-2004   #4
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Throwing more money at the education system as it stands is kind of like putting premium unleaded gas and high grade synthetic oil in your 1986 Yugo with 212k miles on it.

It still runs like shit, just costs more money to make it run.

They need to make teachers accountable for results and accept the fact that in some cases Johnny can't read because he is stupid and no amount of money is going to change that.
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Old 03-21-2004   #5
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Quote:
money for jobs and ed.
Michigan elected a Democratic govenor this last election.... she has slashed the education budget in this state so bad it's scary...

it aint a republican 'thing'
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Old 03-21-2004   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by OldJeff@Mar 21 2004, 07:41 AM
Throwing more money at the education system as it stands is kind of like putting premium unleaded gas and high grade synthetic oil in your 1986 Yugo with 212k miles on it.

It still runs like shit, just costs more money to make it run.

They need to make teachers accountable for results and accept the fact that in some cases Johnny can't read because he is stupid and no amount of money is going to change that.
I agree with you!
Just a note though on little Johnny. Lots of studies have proven that kids' brains aren't physically developed enough to read until they're about 8 - especially boys.
There are thousands of "unschooled" kids who aren't taught to read at the common standard age of 4/5; they get to be 8 or 9 and start learning to read, and actually catch up to their age/grade reading level in 3-6 months.
But in public schools, by the time a kid is 8, they've given up trying to teach the kid how to read and just assume that he can, so he gets lost in the "one standardized way of learning for everyone" method and slips down between the cracks. He ends up "graduating" convinced that he's stupid and having given up on being able to read, when it was never him in the first place, but the way that standard education tries to make one solution fit every kid no matter what their learning style.
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Old 03-21-2004   #7
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Why is anyone ever responding to Meni now??

He has proved himself to be a cut & paster.... he is the body building version of Luke Ford.

I doubt Meni has had an original idea dealing with politics in his life.

I have one word for you Meni: BORING



Stop being lazy and become a critical thinker.
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Old 03-21-2004   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mike AI@Mar 21 2004, 10:53 AM
Why is anyone ever responding to Meni now??

He has proved himself to be a cut & paster.... he is the body building version of Luke Ford.

I doubt Meni has had an original idea dealing with politics in his life.

I have one word for you Meni: BORING



Stop being lazy and become a critical thinker.
It's funny to watch what catalyst it takes to get different people interested in politics.

For Meni it was the thought of not being able to listen to Howard Stern....
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Old 03-21-2004   #9
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Meni would make a great spokesperson for autistic people. he could babble all day long about injustices like "why republicans don't demand that the ratio of female Power Rangers to male Power Rangers be equal" and then everyone would just look at him with a sympathetic smile and give him a few nickels and all could walk away feeling good about the experience without having to address the ignorance of the remarks. it would be a happy, feel good time for the whole crowd and everyone would walk away with some sense of satisfaction and accomplishment.




Last edited by JR at Mar 21 2004, 06:52 PM
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Old 03-22-2004   #10
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I think Stern already filled that position.
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Old 03-22-2004   #11
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Oh, please ... Ed McMahan could run a "Star Search" for a great spokesperson for autistic people around here.
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Old 03-22-2004   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by Carrie@Mar 21 2004, 03:09 AM
I suppose you think that Bush has put no money towards education and made no effort to create or encourage the creation of jobs.
Compared to the billions over in Iraq
fuck NO
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Old 03-22-2004   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Colin@Mar 21 2004, 06:50 AM
Meni,

Federal spending on education under Bush has increased 65%. It is commonly said he has never met a spending bill he didn't like.

There are 5 million more people employed in the US today than there were 4 years ago. You can look up those numbers at the Department of Labor website.

January, 2004. 138.6 million employed.
1999. 133.4 million employed.

Unemployment is below its post 1960's average right now. What would you consider good unemployment numbers? I think 5.6% is more than reasonable.
colin 3 million less jobs
since he took office pal
wake up
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Old 03-22-2004   #14
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Originally posted by Mike AI@Mar 21 2004, 10:53 AM
Why is anyone ever responding to Meni now??

He has proved himself to be a cut & paster.... he is the body building version of Luke Ford.

I doubt Meni has had an original idea dealing with politics in his life.

I have one word for you Meni: BORING



Stop being lazy and become a critical thinker.
Mike I save that for chicks and sports
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Old 03-22-2004   #15
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hey I hate bush
you guys like bush
there is it in a nutshell
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Old 03-22-2004   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Meni@Mar 22 2004, 12:20 PM
hey I hate bush
you guys like bush
there is it in a nutshell
I dont like Bush.

you are just as closed minded and shallow as those you think you hate. it is beginning to look like some sort of co-dependency scenario. you NEED Bush so you can be Meni.
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Old 03-22-2004   #17
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Actually I prefer shaved ....

... or at least neatly trimmed
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Old 03-22-2004   #18
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Having a discussion with Meni about Bush is kinda like discussing whether Barney the Dinosaur is gay with a 4 year old.
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Old 03-22-2004   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hell Puppy@Mar 22 2004, 11:39 PM
Having a discussion with Meni about Bush is kinda like discussing whether Barney the Dinosaur is gay with a 4 year old.
:P :P :P
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Old 03-22-2004   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hell Puppy@Mar 22 2004, 10:39 PM
Having a discussion with Meni about Bush is kinda like discussing whether Barney the Dinosaur is gay with a 4 year old.
pearl!

(or would you prefer a pearl necklace pup?)
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Old 03-22-2004   #21
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Originally posted by cj+Mar 22 2004, 11:05 PM-->
QUOTE (cj @ Mar 22 2004, 11:05 PM)
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Old 03-22-2004   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Colin@Mar 21 2004, 06:50 AM
January, 2004. 138.6 million employed.
1999. 133.4 million employed.
I've been wondering this for a little while now

Hows is that possible ?
5 mil more people employed but unemployment rate was about 1% lower in 99

Was there a huge population shift in the last 5 years ?
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Old 03-22-2004   #23
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i'd rather diamonds over pearls :P
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Old 03-22-2004   #24
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i'd rather diamonds over pearls :P
That new avatar is making me hard too!
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Old 03-22-2004   #25
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Originally posted by slavdogg+Mar 23 2004, 12:18 AM-->
QUOTE (slavdogg @ Mar 23 2004, 12:18 AM)
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Old 03-22-2004   #26
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Originally posted by slavdogg+Mar 22 2004, 11:18 PM-->
QUOTE (slavdogg @ Mar 22 2004, 11:18 PM)
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Old 03-22-2004   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Meni@Mar 22 2004, 08:27 PM

And oprano is fun
its full of old fucks who berate me cuz I hate bush
i just do it because you hate. it has nothing to do with Bush. Bush needs to go. You are no less arrogant, one sided and shallow than he is because you can only see one side of the issues. why do you think you are different than Bush?

You are like the little Bush Jr of Oprano.
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Old 03-22-2004   #28
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Originally posted by JR+Mar 22 2004, 11:34 PM-->
QUOTE (JR @ Mar 22 2004, 11:34 PM)
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Old 03-22-2004   #29
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Originally posted by Carrie+Mar 21 2004, 07:47 AM-->
QUOTE (Carrie @ Mar 21 2004, 07:47 AM)
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Old 03-23-2004   #30
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Meni, you're a fucking idiot... and that's the nicest way I can put that. You don't have a solution for shit. All you can do is spout your hatred for Bush and blame him for everything. I almost feel sorry for your feeble-minded ass.

Since you aren't a natural-born citizen and have less than 3 decades under your belt perhaps you could enlighten us with what YOU perceive to be the solution instead of spouting tired rhetoric back at those who actually know you are a simpleton?
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Old 03-23-2004   #31
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Originally posted by darksoft@Mar 23 2004, 12:10 AM
Meni, you're a fucking idiot... and that's the nicest way I can put that. You don't have a solution for shit. All you can do is spout your hatred for Bush and blame him for everything. I almost feel sorry for your feeble-minded ass.

Since you aren't a natural-born citizen and have less than 3 decades under your belt perhaps you could enlighten us with what YOU perceive to be the solution instead of spouting tired rhetoric back at those who actually know you are a simpleton?
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAA



brilliantly put!
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Old 03-23-2004   #32
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Originally posted by darksoft@Mar 23 2004, 12:10 AM
Meni, you're a fucking idiot... and that's the nicest way I can put that. You don't have a solution for shit. All you can do is spout your hatred for Bush and blame him for everything. I almost feel sorry for your feeble-minded ass.

Since you aren't a natural-born citizen and have less than 3 decades under your belt perhaps you could enlighten us with what YOU perceive to be the solution instead of spouting tired rhetoric back at those who actually know you are a simpleton?
oh
manchester nh isn't the USA?
solutions me?
i'm not president
talk deficit
talk jobs
talk ed
talk fucked up bullshit Iraq
talk cheney
talk the religious right
ok?
nice name
darksoft
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Old 03-23-2004   #33
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Don't blame bush for the deficit?
don't blame bush for spending $$$$$$$$$$$$ in Iraq?
who should I blame
you dont' know me dude
Hell only time i was out of the us is visitin montreal for a few hours
born and raised in the good ole' usa
home of the free
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Old 03-23-2004   #34
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and less than 3 decades?
thank you
i do get mistaken for mid twenties
i'll be 35 september
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Old 03-23-2004   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by darksoft@Mar 23 2004, 12:07 AM
it started going down the poop shoot the same time that they eliminated corporal punishment from schools. .
You have a good point there but there were other factors such as a changing society
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Old 03-23-2004   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by Meni@Mar 23 2004, 12:25 AM
Don't blame bush for the deficit?
don't blame bush for spending $$$$$$$$$$$$ in Iraq?
who should I blame
you dont' know me dude
Hell only time i was out of the us is visitin montreal for a few hours
born and raised in the good ole' usa
home of the free
Come on, Meni ... get with the program.

If it's a good thing, Bush is responsible.

If it's a bad thing, Bush is not responsible - it was probably Clinton, and besides, Bush is focused.

That's only if the bad thing is really bad. See, what's bad under Bush and the Republicans might have been good under Clinton (stalling the appointment of judges, for example). What's good under Bush and the Republicans was probably bad under Clinton (nation building, deficit spending).

If you cut and paste things that do not support the President - remember, he may be wrong, but he's focused - you lack the ability to think critically. If you post every possible reason for the war in Iraq except saving Iraq from gay marriage, you are have a brilliant understanding of real politik, and may even, in fact, be focused yourself.

The Cliff notes version -

Rule Number 1: Bush Good, Democrats Bad.
Rule Number 2: If it appears that Bush is bad, and it is not possible to blame Clinton and liberalactivistjudges, see rule number 1 - and remember, he's focused.
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Old 03-23-2004   #37
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When I was going thru school, and I am a few years older then Meni, the loss of corporal punishment was the last straw that broke the camels back.

When the schools were not allowed to remove the negative influences, i.e. drug dealers, scum bags who didn't wish to learn and were thrown into the schoool system by uncaring mothers and fathers of third world countries, i.e. fucking Mexico, to babysit them because their parents couldn't be bothered, as well as the supposedly upper-class, who are no less resposnsible, that is when shit hit the fan.

Meni, you have offered NO solution. You continuously blame Bush when he has come in at the tail end of the problem. You need fucking help. Clinton was a fucking joke and he was a democrat. Regan and Bush Sr. were a fucking joke. They ALL contributed to the downfall of the American education system, as well as many other things.

You wanna blame someone? Blame yourself.

I have a 16 year old that has come up thru the same school system as I had and what it is today is fucking insane. I wouldn't wish it on anyones kids, and yet here it is. It's not the fault of Bush. Get off your Bush kick, you ignorant fuck. It happened before him and will continue long after him, your ranting aside.
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Old 03-23-2004   #38
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Originally posted by Meni@Mar 22 2004, 11:27 PM
colin get your calculator out
then find out all people who aren't collecting umemployment but still are jobless
Meni you're an idiot

who ever cared to count the people that have money or live off someone but dont care to work or need or want unemployment benefits ??

And Meni for someone that was born and live in the GOOD OL USA for 35 years you should remember well when anything under 6% unemployment was considered FULL FUCKIN emlpoyment.
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Old 03-23-2004   #39
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Stay tuned tomorrow for

The Passion of the Meni
episode V, The implosion.
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Old 03-23-2004   #40
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QUOTE (Meni @ Mar 23 2004, 12:02 AM)
Quote:
Originally posted by -JR@Mar 22 2004, 11:34 PM
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Old 03-23-2004   #41
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Stay tuned tomorrow for

The Passion of the Meni
episode V, The implosion.
I hope you are wrong about the scheduling of the implosion episode.

I was hoping for one good debate between Meni and Torone first.
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Old 03-23-2004   #42
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Hey Dark...
When I was in elementary school, my Principal had two wooden paddles - one with holes, and one without.
If you were being a true brat and deserved to get your ass spanked, you did. Your only hope was that you could convince him to NOT use the one with the holes - it hurt a lot more.

He absolutely hated to use it though, and would sit talking with us for a really long time before he finally sighed and said "well, it's time... bend over the desk..." and deliver that much-needed discipline.
All it took was one visit to his office to instill total respect for him - with or without a spanking. Of all the teachers and adults in that school, the one person we really didn't want to disappoint was Principal Carey. (Yes, that was his name.) And notice I say disappoint, not piss off. He was like a second Dad to us and it really made you feel like shit when you did something bad enough to disappoint his expectations of you.

Nowadays they can't even tell kids to pull their pants up so their ass isn't showing without being accused of racial profiling or culture oppression. Ugh.
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Old 03-23-2004   #43
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Meni, let's imagine something.
Imagine that there is a man that gathers your family together and forces them to watch as your father is lowered feet-first into a meat grinder.
Imagine that he takes your mother and your sister and locks them away from everyone - even each other - and rapes them repeatedly. He also offers them up as "prizes" for his sons and as payoffs for his buddies, and they are raped by these men as well.
Imagine this man decided that he needed to test out a new gas bomb his scientists had just developed, and he chooses your hometown that you grew up in, with all of your childhood friends and high school sweethearts who are still living there with their kids - as his testing area to see what happens.
Imagine that this man is telling the world he has no weapons at all, but everyday your children come home scared to death, talking about all of the men who came into their school and brought "space suits" and gas masks along. Not to mention the very large guns that each of these men was carrying in the school hallways in front of your small children.

How much money would it be worth, to you, to find this man?
At what point would you say "No no, it's just not worth it anymore, it's costing too much money. Leave him alone and let him keep doing these things to other people."
A few thousand? A hundred thousand? A million? 80 million?

Hussein and his sons did these things to families every day for decades, Meni.
How much money is "worth it" to end decades of fear, torture, terrorism, and gassing?
And how much money is "worth it" to rebuild anything we knock down in an effort to find this man, to rebuild basic necessities like water lines and electricity lines that this man had disabled in order to keep his people weak and frightened? To stay there and work with the people so that they could come out of hiding and take control over their own lives, government, and future again after living so long under this man's control?

How much money is that worth, Meni?

Quit bitching about Stern's latest bullshit numbers on Bush, quit blaming everything on people who happen to have faith (whether they're right-wing, left-wing, or none of the above), and instead go down to your local City Hall and throw your hat into the ring as Mayor or for a position in your State's local congress.
You want more jobs for people? Then YOU work to bring those jobs to your area. While you're at it, convince the people who are on welfare and are perfectly healthy that yes, they really CAN get up and get a job at McDonald's, that it isn't more of a smack to their precious pride than sitting and watching Jerry Springer and Ricki Lake all day long.
You want better education? Then YOU work to get more money out of the hands of superintendents and filtered instead down into the classroom so that the kids can have the things they need. YOU work to set standards in your community that teachers have to pass tests in order to teach. YOU help get rid of bullshit "quotas" that force teachers to pass failing students.

YOU do something to fix it, rather than sitting on your pretty little high-pro-glow ass bitching about how one man in government isn't fixing all of this FOR you.
That is, if your tanning sessions, gym appointments, and watching Jenna's dogs doesn't tax your schedule too much already.
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Old 03-23-2004   #44
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Oh, gee ... I just used up three boxes of Kleenex.

You want to go for the emotional factor, Carrie? You want to ask my girlfriend how many goddamned Iraqis her son is worth?

Did those things happen? Probably - although I suspect when the truth is told much of the "information" we have about Saddam's regime will turn out to be in the same league as the Germans killing babies in Belgium in 1914, or the Iraqis ripping babies out of incubators in Kuwait in 1991.

Quite a sea-change in American politics, however, if the neoconservatives have decided that Jimmy Carter was right all along, and that the human rights of people overseas are not just worth considering, but are worth expending American lives for. In a manuer executed more skillfullly than an about-face by a crack military drill team, we're now notnationbuilding in Iraq to defend the downtrodden (and oil rich). Granted, all this sob story stuff is pretty fucking convenient, since the WMD/connections to alQaida rationale for the war didn't materialze. What I'm still struggling to figure out is how the very same people on the right who have their heartstrings plucked by the poor suffering Iraqis could have ignored it for fucking decades before it became a problem.

Just out of curiousity, how many nations in the Coalition of the Rented and Duped have human rights records that can rival Saddam's? Will we be taking them on any time soon? And what about our good buddies, Pakistan? The Pakistanis CREATED the Taliban, and those forces are STILL involved in the intelligence and military of Pakistan. The Pakistani military is full of unrepentant Islamic fundamentalists, and Mussarif's hold on power is tenuous at best. I cannot believe how many people were fooled by that dog-and-pony show last week with the "high ranking Taliban leader" bullshit - coincidentally taking place when Colin Powell dropped into town. The government we are trusting in Pakistan is the same government that just forgave those who passed nuclear secrets to any nation that had the $, and is less stable than the Shah of Iran was in the late 1970s.

That same Iraqi who used to fear his government now can't leave his house. That same Iraqi who used to worry about the men in space suits scaring his children is now worried that some terrorist scum will blow them up. It could be alQaida, could be unrepentant Bathist, or it will (if not already) soon likely be garden variety Iraqi extremists - Sunni, Shitte, or Kurd. In less than 3 months we're "turning over power" to ... well, we'll figure that out as we go along.

With all due respect, Carrie, that whole "protect the underdog" line of bullshit rings very hollow from the American right - who not so very long ago were howling at Clinton for intervening in Bosnia, although that conflict involved very real and unquestionable imitation of Nazi atrocities, and the threat of intervention from a multitude of nations offered the protential of war between a number of our allies. Of course, the Bosnians, Serbs, Croats, and Albanians don't have any oil, and - call me a cynic - the fact that the President of the United States who wanted to do this was from the other party just might have had something to do with it.

I'm sorry, but when neoconservatives start playing out the sob stories about horrible human rights abuses of oppressed peoples, my bullshit detector goes off. Those people either have something we want, there is an agenda hidden someplace - or all the other lies they wrap their policies up in have been exposed, and it's the last line of defense.
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Old 03-23-2004   #45
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Originally posted by slavdogg+Mar 22 2004, 11:18 PM-->
QUOTE (slavdogg @ Mar 22 2004, 11:18 PM)
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Old 03-23-2004   #46
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Originally posted by Meni@Mar 22 2004, 11:27 PM
How's this
the umemployment rate only counts who is COLLECTING unemployment at the moment
so its NOT ACCURATE
turn on your TV
3 million jobs lost with Bush in office

colin get your calculator out
then find out all people who aren't collecting umemployment but still are jobless

And oprano is fun
its full of old fucks who berate me cuz I hate bush
Being neither a Democrat nor a Republican, I don't care whether you hate Bush or love him.

Turn on the TV? Yeah, great source.

3 million more unemployed today than 4 years ago.
5 million more employed today than 4 years ago.

Those are the straight numbers. What conclusion do you draw?

Unemployment rate: 5.6%. Below average.
Employment/total population rate : Excellent. Not as high as during Clinton era
GDP. Great 2 quarters.
Deficit. Very high.

My conclusion? We're in an above average economy paid for by deficit spending. The economy is not as good as it was during Clinton's second term but overall better than most.
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Old 03-23-2004   #47
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Originally posted by PornoDoggy@Mar 23 2004, 01:37 AM
I'm sorry, but when neoconservatives start playing out the sob stories about horrible human rights abuses of oppressed peoples, my bullshit detector goes off. Those people either have something we want, there is an agenda hidden someplace - or all the other lies they wrap their policies up in have been exposed, and it's the last line of defense.
ahahaahahahahahaha!

So true!
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Old 03-23-2004   #48
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"well, it's time... bend over the desk..." and deliver that much-needed discipline.
Not sure this sentence should be uttered to a 15 or 16 year old , just puts too many visions into my head, maybe I have been doing this porn thing too long

Unemployment is always blamed on the president at the time, even though the effect of most legislation take years to become evident.

Education system has been a shit pile for at least 20 years, probably more, I have heard every president I can remember get blamed for the failing education system, (my guess is the education problems have nothing to do with the president)

I am more than OK with bashing Bush, but at least do so for things he is actually responsible for

John Ashcroft - Lying about the reasons for the War in Iraq - Shit just being from Texas (anyone that thinks I am being unfair needs to remember the shit Carter took for being a backwoods Georgia hick)

I guess Homophobic Christian Fundamentalist Redneck is a good trait for the leader of the free world



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Old 03-23-2004   #49
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« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Originally posted by PornoDoggy+Mar 22 2004, 09:38 PM-->
QUOTE (PornoDoggy @ Mar 22 2004, 09:38 PM)
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Old 03-23-2004   #50
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Originally posted by OldJeff@Mar 21 2004, 04:41 AM
Throwing more money at the education system as it stands is kind of like putting premium unleaded gas and high grade synthetic oil in your 1986 Yugo with 212k miles on it.

It still runs like shit, just costs more money to make it run.

They need to make teachers accountable for results and accept the fact that in some cases Johnny can't read because he is stupid and no amount of money is going to change that.
right on
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