Loyal Micro Niches

[Dianna Vesta]

Menstruation, trampling, rubber, strong body odor, infantilism, enema, CBT, girdles- old fashion underwear, pantyhose, heels… the list is quite long. I remember writing a monthly column for a fetish magazine back in 1989 and receiving hundreds of letters each month. Desperate fetishist wrote pleading letters often with tributes of cash. I began to see that these bizarre little niches were more common then one might think. A typical tits and ass boy who buys Playboy to jerk off to may also have some other little demon in his closet that he keeps safely guarded. Maybe he has a thing for smelly socks and keeps a few pair hidden away in a Ziploc bag. He stole them from his girlfriend or he’s found a private mail order source in a black and white fetish newspaper.

The purveyors of these micro niches are home based businesses catering to a client base larger then you could imagine. I myself use to sell my worn shoes and stockings for replacement and profit. A worn pair of stockings would easily make me $50.00 and shoes I sold for $100.00. I could have made more off pictures and video but I just didn’t have the time.

Certainly there are sites profiting from these micro niches. The most successful are run by webmasters who are also into that fetish. A perfect example is Steve from Lightening Cash. He was into Cheerleaders and began developing his fetish. The only real way to harness this is to be into and really understand the mindset of your subscriber. Collectively these sites make up a larger chunk of the web then you might think.

These customers are loyal and will retain month after month as long as you’re able to feed their niche. Typically these sites don’t charge as much as most because they normally don’t run strong affiliate programs and there aren’t any revenues to split or share. If you speak to a fetishist they will tell you that they have several reliable sources yet there are always one or two companies they stay in close contact with. A few years back I did a survey with a large group of fetishist. One of the questions was how much they spent each month on fetish paraphernalia (items, books, magazines, videos). The average was $100.00! There were even higher amounts which included phone sex. I asked if they preferred going to the web verses a bookstore. This was a few years ago before broadband so many still prefer mail order or going to the local smut store.

It would be impossible for large programs to harness this traffic unless they were will to assign site publishers or consultants to work with staff on producing a site that successfully caters to a niche. There is a larger investment in the front end as you work to secure a niche base. Once successful and you supply the goods, that customer probably won’t ever leave.

We’ve seen the growth of niche in the past couple of years. It isn’t surprising that webmasters are realizing that subscribers prefer sites that cater to a niche and not a smorgasbord of tits and ass. They have begun to realize the loyalty in this market even if they can’t successful harness it.

I know Photogregg is reading this. Maybe he’ll confirm what I’m saying. Niche producers have an eye for the niche they are into. Gregg shoots great niche because he has an eye for it and we all know what a kinky little fuck he is! I’m asked to produce content; articles, stories & pics – because of my experience in niche. Just like Gregg gets the right angles or the correct props, I’ll make sure I use certain buzz words or detail my sexual description catering to a certain niche.

Are the number there? Yes. If I get 5 signups a day off a micro niche it’s worth it to me because I know I can retain them. If I have a base of 200 subscribers at around 24.95 a month that’s 4990.00. Keep in mind that my content demands aren’t as high. I can get away with a small weekly update. A few photo sets, a few video clips and one story. You basically want to give them enough masturbation material to last them through the week. Most don’t want to go searching through archives when they have good weekly updates catering to their niche.

I’d love to hear your feed back on this. Do you currently run niche sites?

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Dianna

[cj]

The most successful are run by webmasters who are also into that fetish.

The reason behind this is that not many people run these type of sites other than those who are into the micro-niche themselves ... how could you build a fake sock odour site? i have been building members areas for 5 years, trying to make something out of not much usually, I often research a niche and source some exclusive content ... but there are some niches i just don't get ... most porn purveyors prefer to stick with what they know - which is why you should be working on creating an online empire with the wide range of rare niches you can cater to.

Are the number there? Yes. If I get 5 signups a day off a micro niche it’s worth it to me because I know I can retain them. If I have a base of 200 subscribers at around 24.95 a month that’s 4990.00.

How much is it going to cost you to set up the members area for these micro niches? I'd guess roughly 3 times as much as a standard hardcore paysite? ... maybe not for you Dianna, as you have certain resources & market knowledge at your disposal that not many have ... but for most of us, the profit to grief ratio is wak ... lots of outlay for a potential 200 subscribers a month ... i'd rather go for a bigger market for less effort & grief ...

you have a unique position in this industry with so much history & specific knowledge at your disposal ... instead of trying to change what exists, focus more on where you can fit into that dynamic & benefit from it.

I see your business as having a few key areas of revenue that fit into the evolving industry dynamic ... you've mentioned all of them before ...

1) niched 'ezine' content plugins for paysites covering all the micro-niches & niches you can think of. contact one of the big feed companies like pornholio or (fuck, i can't even think of a big content company) who will resell your 'plugins' for you for a %. sit back and forget about that part of the business except for doing updates on the ezines. because you are already doing certain updates to your niche sites, structure it so that your paysites and leasing paysites are plugging in the same thing ... you have the same amount of update work, but a second revenue stream with a cost of nothing but bandwidth.

2) affiliate program, with a number of paysite frontends that are designed to CONVERT with members areas built with a collection of plugins from your collection. pay a recurring or an active member payout to reduce your initial payout risk. build some really good tools for webmasters, good banners etc ... then get out there and boardwhore your ass off ;-)))) webmasters WILL try your product if it is unique, matches 'keywords' in their traffic, & at least pays *enough*.

3) buy some traffic from sharky's mailers & i think mikeai also run double opt in mailers ... there are plenty of people around here who will work with you to build a reasonably priced traffic source & who are always looking for unique smut to send to their newsletter subscribers.


i want to build a frontend or something for your content ... i keep looking at your site and wanting to take the information and rearrange it. ;-) maybe one night if i am inspired i might play in photoshop

or you could run a design contest to launch the affiliate program ... have webmasters build your sites for you and only pay the one who wins just kidding ... there are lots of incentives you can offer ... traffic, money, prizes etc.

ok, i'm done brainfarting now ;-)

[Dianna Vesta]

Lots of stuff here. I’m going to snip some and reply to some. CJ, you always have given great advice. Don’t think I’m not listening to you and some other great advice I’ve gotten here. See below…

>>>The reason behind this is that not many people run these type of sites other than those who are into the micro-niche themselves ... how could you build a fake sock odour site? i have been building members areas for 5 years, trying to make something out of not much usually, I often research a niche and source some exclusive content ... but there are some niches i just don't get ... most porn purveyors prefer to stick with what they know - which is why you should be working on creating an online empire with the wide range of rare niches you can cater to.>>>

DV: I pretty much do stick with niches. The biggest challenge is content. I spend so much time trying to purchase, produce and harness it that it leaves me little time for anything else.


QUOTE
Are the number there? Yes. If I get 5 signups a day off a micro niche it’s worth it to me because I know I can retain them. If I have a base of 200 subscribers at around 24.95 a month that’s 4990.00.


>>>How much is it going to cost you to set up the members area for these micro niches? I'd guess roughly 3 times as much as a standard hardcore paysite? ... maybe not for you Dianna, as you have certain resources & market knowledge at your disposal that not many have ... but for most of us, the profit to grief ratio is wak ... lots of outlay for a potential 200 subscribers a month ... i'd rather go for a bigger market for less effort & grief ...

you have a unique position in this industry with so much history & specific knowledge at your disposal ... instead of trying to change what exists, focus more on where you can fit into that dynamic & benefit from it.>>>>

DV: This kinda what I do and what I’m doing. More below.



>>>I see your business as having a few key areas of revenue that fit into the evolving industry dynamic ... you've mentioned all of them before ...

1) niched 'ezine' content plugins for paysites covering all the micro-niches & niches you can think of. contact one of the big feed companies like pornholio or (fuck, i can't even think of a big content company) who will resell your 'plugins' for you for a %. sit back and forget about that part of the business except for doing updates on the ezines. because you are already doing certain updates to your niche sites, structure it so that your paysites and leasing paysites are plugging in the same thing ... you have the same amount of update work, but a second revenue stream with a cost of nothing but bandwidth.>>>>>>


DV: It’s taken me over 6 months to pull enough resources and information together just to plot out a plan to create these plugins. I must say that I vacillate because the market is so unpredictable. The writing/audio content I produce isn’t cheap. It makes more sense for me to build leased galleries. The end of 2002 it looked like sites would gear more towards exclusive content which makes a lot of sense to me.

So I approached two large companies and suggested that I build sites, produced quality niche sites and they resell them in their network. Don’t you remember my rant about this last year? If a large program network focused on promotions, traffic, affiliates and left site production to an owner/publisher paying a %, it seems to me like they’re niche sites would be successful.

I will admit that I’m not that savvy with traffic, affiliate programs, etc. My sites endure, they’ve been around a long time and they make money.

I’d love to find a company to do that. I got interest but no bites.

>>>2) affiliate program, with a number of paysite frontends that are designed to CONVERT with members areas built with a collection of plugins from your collection. pay a recurring or an active member payout to reduce your initial payout risk. build some really good tools for webmasters, good banners etc ... then get out there and boardwhore your ass off ;-)))) webmasters WILL try your product if it is unique, matches 'keywords' in their traffic, & at least pays *enough*. >>>

DV: lol- isn’t that what I’m kinda doing here? Lol- I just installed all kinds of automated scripts, built an online community www.othersex.com that is starting to bring me all kind of traffic and sign-ups. I’m ready to hire more staff and build a shit load of niche sites. I’ve got a dozen small niche producers who will sell me their stuff cheap cheap – it just takes time, I’m moving along. Trust me CJ I’m aware of the missing component in my network. I get offers from little fish. I need a big fish.

>>>3) buy some traffic from sharky's mailers & i think mikeai also run double opt in mailers ... there are plenty of people around here who will work with you to build a reasonably priced traffic source & who are always looking for unique smut to send to their newsletter subscribers.>>>

DV: We’ve bought these in the past and they didn’t work well for us.


>>>i want to build a frontend or something for your content ... i keep looking at your site and wanting to take the information and rearrange it. ;-) maybe one night if i am inspired i might play in photoshop >>>

DV: which site? Niche Cartel? Lol- Let me tell you what… I had a very good plan, went through THREE programmers. My biggest challenge is to articulate what I want and have someone consistent enough to follow that plan. Right now I’m developing product and I’ll get back to Niche Cartel. I’m training a girl to do my updates. I’m able to focus more on writing & seeking out producers. On many of my sites I am the draw. There’s a huge difference in my retention when my members see me active on my sites. I can’t be everywhere.

>>>or you could run a design contest to launch the affiliate program ... have webmasters build your sites for you and only pay the one who wins just kidding ... there are lots of incentives you can offer ... traffic, money, prizes etc. >>>

DV: Thank you. All good advice & you are a pro. I am working on several projects and I’ve already launched a few. I’d like to get at least two more sites open. In Niche Cartel I have a mall program that hasn’t been set-up. I have over a dozen artist – writers, photographers, video, sound… who are desperately looking for a way to sell their content. There’s just not enough profit for me to broker pennies so the only way I’d do this is an automated cart that let them manage their own store. I’ll use one of my merchant accounts, no problem.

I need a backend lease/plugin script that lets a webmaster sign-on, choose the content directories they want and subscribe monthly to my feeds. I just haven’t found anything secure enough or automated enough. I’m close. Once that’s in I’ll start loading it up, feed my sites and lease it out. Still, I wonder the direction of the industry.

Here’s a question:

If I leased my sites as plugins, as entire ezines, how does that affect my content license? Content I purchase a license to publish only in that site?

If you look at SWOIT, an excellent concept but isn’t that a loop hole? I mean its one site accessing a bunch of others. By leasing my Ezine plug in, would I basically be doing the same thing?

I’m ready to build more sites. If a big fish swims my way, I’ll listen to offers, however I’m making money now, my signups are increasing and I still have time to play with my farm. Eventually I’d like to write full time and let someone else worry about bandwidth, conversions, etc.

It’s all good.

[photogregg]

We've notice our customers are going from mainstream fuck/suck porn to niche based exclusive content.

Have a few that thinking ahead and will take over a larege slice of traffic from each particular niche

Spanking customer is opening his site next week with our exclusive content. long ass tour, but he has galleries for webmasters, every size banner and ad imaginable, free content, pre-made galleries, etc., and is also buying search words from SE's, and more....think it will do well.

http://www.badtushy.com/main.html

Niche paysites, that are well done, have the traffic, good customer support, great content that is updated regularly will kick ass.

[Dianna Vesta]

Originally posted by photogregg@May 24 2003, 04:15 PM
Niche paysites, that are well done, have the traffic, good customer support, great content that is updated regularly will kick ass.

I think exclusive or semi is important for nice. If a guy is into a niche he's probably explored any site in that niche, right? He's not going to stay subscribed to a site with off topic content or the same shit he can see on 100's of other sites.

Look at hogtied.com - Loyal following and a huge ass site. It also proves that even the tit's and ass, never considers kinky sex, has a little kink somewhere.

[sarah_webinc]

micro niche is my main income in this industry. I simply am not very good at selling teens and frankly they don't interest me. However, I am fascinated by fetishes. They aren't my own but I thrist for knowledge on them - I am sure that partially comes from having earned my sociology degree.


I keep considering setting up a service that basiclly works as a knowledge bank where confused webmasters come to me to find out about a fetish. I have too much in my brain for them not being my fetishes but I don't think I could do this job everyday if there wasn't a bit of a mental challenge now and then.

[nlphoto]

I definitely agree with most of what you've said Dianna... I have been micro-niche since I started. I have never been a prolific shooter, being a one person operation from day one.

This has been the primary reason for my not setting up a subscription site... like Photogregg mentioned above, I concentrate on quality, not quantity. I have always sold my work as physical products (photo CDs, videos and now DVDs) and individual downloadable series.

My primary domain of nlphoto.com is still offline... I'm about 2 weeks away from finally getting my domain hijacking issue resolved. If you would like Dianna, feel free to check my current alternate entrance at

http://www.onlinepantyhose.com/nlphoto/index1.html


Also as a side note... I now do as much or more business with my mainstream hosiery sales site at

http://www.onlinepantyhose.com/

than I do with my pantyhose content site...

[Dianna Vesta]

Originally posted by sarah_webinc@May 26 2003, 01:13 PM
micro niche is my main income in this industry. I simply am not very good at selling teens and frankly they don't interest me. However, I am fascinated by fetishes. They aren't my own but I thrist for knowledge on them - I am sure that partially comes from having earned my sociology degree.


I keep considering setting up a service that basiclly works as a knowledge bank where confused webmasters come to me to find out about a fetish. I have too much in my brain for them not being my fetishes but I don't think I could do this job everyday if there wasn't a bit of a mental challenge now and then.

Sara this is what I'm hoping to do with Niche Cartel. If you'e that serious take my offer and partner with me on it.

ICQ me- I'm dead ass serious- 365555

[Phoenix66]

Originally posted by nlphoto@May 26 2003, 11:33 AM
I have always sold my work as physical products (photo CDs, videos and now DVDs) and individual downloadable series.

Do you mean you were selling them to individual surfers? Can I ask you how you promoted this and how you protected your stuff from being purchased and illegally used by TGP posters?

Or you ment something else?

[Mike AI]

Niches work, the only problem I see with micro-niches is the cost of shooting exclusive content, compaired to the number of members a micro-niche can/will support.

Sure the members might stay longer, 2-3-4 months - but if you cannot get enough total, then it could still be a losing prospect....

IT is important people know the niches, and also know how to FIND the surfers who are interested in those niches... the old days it was pretty easy... but the SEs, link lists have been so slammed with garbage it is hard for people to find true, dedicated niche sites...

[gigi]

I've had this page bookmarked for a while now and refer to it when I feel the urge to explore different micro-niches...

http://www.odd-sex.com/info/index2.htm

Some interesting...and VERY strange stuff....lol

[nlphoto]

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