I like to promote “Indie Sites” but . . .

[bluemoney]

I wish more of them would offer “leak free tours”. Are there any reason why they shouldn't?


As Buckwheat would say, "just asstin"

[softball]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

I wish more of them would offer “leak free tours”. Are there any reason why they shouldn't?


As Buckwheat would say, "just asstin"

Do you still believe in Santa and the tooth fairy? And...just asstin....why should a tour be "leak free"?

[Toby]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

I wish more of them would offer “leak free tours”. Are there any reason why they shouldn't?

Most of them don't even think about having a separate tour for affiliate traffic, without any external links.

Originally Posted by rhetorical

...why should a tour be "leak free"?

Because traffic leaks reduce conversion ratios. Link trades, reciprocal links for directory listings, etc. are a necessary trade off to gain additional traffic, but they gain nothing for the affiliate. Same goes for links to clip stores, etc.

A few traffic leaks on a tour isn't a deal breaker for me, but all things being equal I'll send more traffic to a site with a leak free affiliate tour.

[bluemoney]

Originally Posted by Toby

Most of them don't even think about having a separate tour for affiliate traffic, without any external links.


Because traffic leaks reduce conversion ratios. Link trades, reciprocal links for directory listings, etc. are a necessary trade off to gain additional traffic, but they gain nothing for the affiliate. Same goes for links to clip stores, etc.

A few traffic leaks on a tour isn't a deal breaker for me, but all things being equal I'll send more traffic to a site with a leak free affiliate tour.

Bingo

[tony404]

our tours are pretty leak proof

[TheEnforcer]

It does make sense to set up leak free tours for affiliates but I can see why they don't.

[RawAlex]

I hit one recently, a ccbill affiliate program I signed up for a while back but didn't promote for some reason. So I checked out the site to see what was on it, to try to find out why I didn't promote it much.

http://www.alexisgolden.com/tour1.html

Ignoring the fact that the tour isn't very attractive, how many holes are there? let's see.
She sell DVDs off the front page (but you don't get paid).

She sells VOD off the front page (but you don't get paid).

Her update page has all links off to other sites, nothing to her own. that includes links to her being on I'm Live, and other sites. There is no selling of her actual site, so you don't get paid.

The "Hot Sexy Bitches" is her link trades with other amateurs and other paysites. You don't get paid.

When I look at the tour, the chance that someone actually hits something that pays me is so small, why would I bother? I sent them an email, and got zero response.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

I hit one recently, a ccbill affiliate program I signed up for a while back but didn't promote for some reason. So I checked out the site to see what was on it, to try to find out why I didn't promote it much.

http://www.alexisgolden.com/tour1.html

Ignoring the fact that the tour isn't very attractive, how many holes are there? let's see.
She sell DVDs off the front page (but you don't get paid).

She sells VOD off the front page (but you don't get paid).

Her update page has all links off to other sites, nothing to her own. that includes links to her being on I'm Live, and other sites. There is no selling of her actual site, so you don't get paid.

The "Hot Sexy Bitches" is her link trades with other amateurs and other paysites. You don't get paid.

When I look at the tour, the chance that someone actually hits something that pays me is so small, why would I bother? I sent them an email, and got zero response.

Looks to me like the classic "managed by a friend" situation....

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

I hit one recently, a ccbill affiliate program I signed up for a while back but didn't promote for some reason. So I checked out the site to see what was on it, to try to find out why I didn't promote it much.

http://www.alexisgolden.com/tour1.html

Ignoring the fact that the tour isn't very attractive, how many holes are there? let's see.
She sell DVDs off the front page (but you don't get paid).

She sells VOD off the front page (but you don't get paid).

Her update page has all links off to other sites, nothing to her own. that includes links to her being on I'm Live, and other sites. There is no selling of her actual site, so you don't get paid.

The "Hot Sexy Bitches" is her link trades with other amateurs and other paysites. You don't get paid.

When I look at the tour, the chance that someone actually hits something that pays me is so small, why would I bother? I sent them an email, and got zero response.

If that is an "indie" site then Homegrown Video is a gardening site full of clips of people raking, planting, and harversting heirloom tomatoes and not an incredible amateur porn site full of people fucking, sucking, and having sex juicier than heirloom tomatoes.

[SteveHardeman]

My sites were designed by my partner who was a successful affiliate prior to becoming the marketing arm of AmateursConvert. I was never an affiliate so I don't know jack about leaks but I believe my sites are leak free.

Not that you asked me to spam your thread but what the heck, I will anyway. :-)

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by SteveHardeman

My sites were designed by my partner who was a successful affiliate prior to becoming the marketing arm of AmateursConvert. I was never an affiliate so I don't know jack about leaks but I believe my sites are leak free.

Not that you asked me to spam your thread but what the heck, I will anyway. :-)

All the links described by RawAlex are considered "leaks". Your designer built the tour with his "program owner" hat on and not the "affiliate hat". There is no fault in that at all but to remedy the situation for potential affiliates you just need versions of the tour that only sell the site itself and are free of all those other upsells - a version where the only purchases possible can be tracked and credited to the affiliate that sent the customer.

Hope that makes sense.

[helix]

I have been promoting the RoyalCash family of sites because their tours and portal page (I use it at root and for the 404's) are leak free. Plenty of promotion content, FHG's and rss feeds. Conversions are good as well. It has probably been the best Sponsor I have promoted. They pay on time, and if I need support they are fast to respond. The only bummer is Spaz has moved on to Club Seventeen. I have to hit him up.

ref - http://royal-cash.com/?agent_id=6079
no ref - http://royal-cash.com/

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by helix

I have been promoting the RoyalCash family of sites because their tours and portal page (I use it at root and for the 404's) are leak free. Plenty of promotion content, FHG's and rss feeds. Conversions are good as well. It has probably been the best Sponsor I have promoted. They pay on time, and if I need support they are fast to respond. The only bummer is Spaz has moved on to Club Seventeen. I have to hit him up.

ref - http://royal-cash.com/?agent_id=6079
no ref - http://royal-cash.com/

Spaz is one of the hardest working program reps in the business.
He understands this business from way back.

He helped establish Extreme Paychecks and any program hes worked for has benefitted from his hard work and business knowledge.

[SteveHardeman]

Originally Posted by Far-L

All the links described by RawAlex are considered "leaks". Your designer built the tour with his "program owner" hat on and not the "affiliate hat". There is no fault in that at all but to remedy the situation for potential affiliates you just need versions of the tour that only sell the site itself and are free of all those other upsells - a version where the only purchases possible can be tracked and credited to the affiliate that sent the customer.

Hope that makes sense.

It makes perfect sense. And that's the way all of my sites are.

[AdorableAudrey]

As an 'indie' when I started it was just me doing it for rlove of porn, exhibitionism, and certain fetishes. Indie = just me and my husband, trying to figure out huow to make our members and ourselves happy with the content and the site, no affiliate manager to tell us how a program needs to work, and no extra man-hours to design lots of versions of our sites.

Still we have learned and have leak-free versions of all our tours, but I will say affiliate sales have never been the majority of my sales and for many indies they may not know how important this is for affiliates, or it may just not be very high on their priority list. As a lady running my own site, I sometimes have to choose whether to spend my time supporting affiliates or members, and webmasters sometimes don't win. (sorry!)

[helix]

Originally Posted by AdorableAudrey

As an 'indie' when I started it was just me doing it for rlove of porn, exhibitionism, and certain fetishes. Indie = just me and my husband, trying to figure out huow to make our members and ourselves happy with the content and the site, no affiliate manager to tell us how a program needs to work, and no extra man-hours to design lots of versions of our sites.

Still we have learned and have leak-free versions of all our tours, but I will say affiliate sales have never been the majority of my sales and for many indies they may not know how important this is for affiliates, or it may just not be very high on their priority list. As a lady running my own site, I sometimes have to choose whether to spend my time supporting affiliates or members, and webmasters sometimes don't win. (sorry!)

I'm getting some 404's when clicking on images on your http://adorableaudrey.com/pics.html page

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by AdorableAudrey

As an 'indie' when I started it was just me doing it for rlove of porn, exhibitionism, and certain fetishes. Indie = just me and my husband, trying to figure out huow to make our members and ourselves happy with the content and the site, no affiliate manager to tell us how a program needs to work, and no extra man-hours to design lots of versions of our sites.

Still we have learned and have leak-free versions of all our tours, but I will say affiliate sales have never been the majority of my sales and for many indies they may not know how important this is for affiliates, or it may just not be very high on their priority list. As a lady running my own site, I sometimes have to choose whether to spend my time supporting affiliates or members, and webmasters sometimes don't win. (sorry!)

And that is exactly what you should be doing, imo. The worst thing a true indie site can do is spend all their efforts on trying to please affiliates that don't send enough sales to support the effort required to maintain them.

We like to think of our marketing efforts divided into three main considerations. Internal traffic that is purchased or otherwise created through trades etc., affiliate traffic, and organic traffic generated through seo. We try to balance our daily efforts to maintain a healthy balance between each and this has served us well. I have seen big successful programs fall apart because they spent all their time on affiliates that eventually deserted them for another program - and because profit margins are so much less due to the high payouts they couldn't sustain bloated operations.

Besides, the more an indie learns how to sell themselves the better he/she becomes teaching affiliates how to sell the product.

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by SteveHardeman

It makes perfect sense. And that's the way all of my sites are.

Yeah, I apologize if it seemed as if I was assuming otherwise.

[MRock]

Originally Posted by Far-L

The worst thing a true indie site can do is spend all their efforts on trying to please affiliates that don't send enough sales to support the effort required to maintain them.

I started to develop an affiliate program, but the above statement was what I found to be true ... we are so diversified beyond the websites now ... a lot has changed over the last few years.

If any one here would be interested in promoting Jill "leak free", I would suggest promoting her through the larger company affiliate programs we work under. Clips.com does real well for us in clip sales and as affiliates. Jill has 6 niche stores you can sell of her videos and you hedge your traffic because the customer is yours even if they wander to other stores on the site and decline to buy a Jill clip.

Jill also works regular on cam at 2 camsites with affiliate programs. Just contact me for her screen names at what sites and I can also supply you with picture sets or short video clips for promotion.

There's still sales in websites, but single file sales and live cam are where the market is going imo. Pay as you go ... buy only what you want is what the customers prefer.

Just sold a clip for $29.99 as I was writing this .... just sayin'

[bluemoney]

Originally Posted by Toby

A few traffic leaks on a tour isn't a deal breaker for me, but all things being equal I'll send more traffic to a site with a leak free affiliate tour.

I'm sure we are not the only one's.

Weather It's worth a program owners time and effort is not for me to say, but I'm sure glad of the one's out there that do.

[helix]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Spaz is one of the hardest working program reps in the business.
He understands this business from way back.

He helped establish Extreme Paychecks and any program hes worked for has benefitted from his hard work and business knowledge.

Plus....anytime I had a question or needed assistance he was available, responsive, helpful and professional. All issues resolved asap.

[spazlabz]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Spaz is one of the hardest working program reps in the business.
He understands this business from way back.

He helped establish Extreme Paychecks and any program hes worked for has benefitted from his hard work and business knowledge.

Thanks Gonzo, always great to hear good things about oneself, I appreciate the kind words

Originally Posted by helix

Plus....anytime I had a question or needed assistance he was available, responsive, helpful and professional. All issues resolved asap.

Thank you too Helix Did you know that I left Royal Cash a month and a half ago and I am now the affiliate manager at Payserve? I am just as available to help ya here and the content is sweet teen content at its best

spaz

[helix]

Originally Posted by spazlabz

Thanks Gonzo, always great to hear good things about oneself, I appreciate the kind words

Thank you too Helix Did you know that I left Royal Cash a month and a half ago and I am now the affiliate manager at Payserve? I am just as available to help ya here and the content is sweet teen content at its best

spaz

I just applied for an affiliate account

[spazlabz]

Originally Posted by helix

I just applied for an affiliate account

Excellent thank you, I have approved the account, as always let me know if ya need anything and I will be all over it


spaz

[helix]

Originally Posted by spazlabz

Excellent thank you, I have approved the account, as always let me know if ya need anything and I will be all over it


spaz

Thanks spaz :-)
l just emailed you.

[spazlabz]

Originally Posted by helix

Thanks spaz :-)
l just emailed you.

got it, I am replying now

spaz

[softball]

http://www.whichaffiliate.com/programs/pages/index.php
http://affiliates.sky.com/

Check out these and other "mainstream" payouts....let me know what you think. Sky tv is Rupert Murdoch, no stranger to marketing. How fast do you think your affiliate code will run out and how much of a traffic leak do you think this is......
Do you think this is where affiliate marketing is really going?

Is Rupert an "indie site"? I think he is.....its all his own work...just on a scale bigger than any porn site could dream of.

And finally, are these brutal costs for affiliate traffic causing porn companies to drop their affiliate programs?

[softball]

and the silence is deafening.

[helix]

I would think Rupert would be considered an indie if he isn't involved with the usual bunch of PPC marketers, Copeac,Shareasale,CJ, etc..
I have never used an indie in mainstream, but I can tell you it is harder to get approved as an affiliate for mainstream than it used to be. Plus you really have to be pushing big numbers now to get them to bump the payout. Little guys are getting squeezed out.

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

http://www.whichaffiliate.com/programs/pages/index.php
http://affiliates.sky.com/

Check out these and other "mainstream" payouts....let me know what you think. Sky tv is Rupert Murdoch, no stranger to marketing. How fast do you think your affiliate code will run out and how much of a traffic leak do you think this is......
Do you think this is where affiliate marketing is really going?

Is Rupert an "indie site"? I think he is.....its all his own work...just on a scale bigger than any porn site could dream of.

And finally, are these brutal costs for affiliate traffic causing porn companies to drop their affiliate programs?

imo...

The affiliate is partly being dropped as more programs realize that in-house traffic management in the long run can be more profitable. I also think adult programs are realizing that only affiliates that actually make money are worth (x$) investment in beyond a reasonable expectation of professional courtesy. As for leaks, standards are constantly changing for what is or is not acceptable with webmasters in adult and mainstream. So the program with the most flexibility to accomodate those changes will naturally thrive.

[softball]

Originally Posted by Far-L

imo...

The affiliate is partly being dropped as more programs realize that in-house traffic management in the long run can be more profitable. I also think adult programs are realizing that only affiliates that actually make money are worth (x$) investment in beyond a reasonable expectation of professional courtesy. As for leaks, standards are constantly changing for what is or is not acceptable with webmasters in adult and mainstream. So the program with the most flexibility to accomodate those changes will naturally thrive.

Well put. IMHO, its not about leaks. Its about making money in a brave new world. Here's a question. If programs paid say....20 per cent and tons of marginal affiliates disappeared. Would those who stuck with it make more money? Would we all make more money?