Ray Guhn Pleads Guilty

[softball]

Originally Posted by RawAlex

Not correct - if the male performers are not being paid (hypothetical) then you don't have a valid contract for modelling, which turns the event into girls getting paid to fuck guys (aka prostitution). Everyone performing sex acts in a movie needs to be paid due consideration for their performance. That can be a small amount of money or even "copies of completed videos" (work for print style agreement) but there always has to be some form of recompense.

Without that, it is just hiring a hooker - the differences between the two are very small and actually only really confirmed in California.

i believe you are wrong on this. They had "parties" that had nothing to do with the website where girls were hired to fuck them and their friends. That is why they are going to serve time.
They, including Larry Walters, tried to pitch it to the business as a threat to filming porn. Even this forum had a link to their charity site. I for one, will not pay to defend anyone who breaks the local law to have fun and get laid and then tries to pitch it as a first amendment issue.
John Stagliano has a more worthwhile case as far as I am concerned and he is doing the right thing. Larry Walters is a snake.
These guys are everything that is wrong with porn.

[Hammer]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

i believe you are wrong on this. They had "parties" that had nothing to do with the website where girls were hired to fuck them and their friends.

That's what they claimed but that's not necessarily what happened and not what they were charged with. One of their websites featured orgies (sex parties) so the allegation was that they had these sex parties for the purpose of producing content for the site, in which case, all performers should have been paid.

[softball]

Originally Posted by Hammer

That's what they claimed but that's not necessarily what happened and not what they were charged with. One of their websites featured orgies (sex parties) so the allegation was that they had these sex parties for the purpose of producing content for the site, in which case, all performers should have been paid.

I think that pretty much sums up what I said. I actually don't care if they shot their private orgies then put them on the net. My opinion still stands and what they did was wrong. This is not a first amendment case. It is a bunch of sleazebags getting laid, perhaps publishing the events, then trying to get us to support them. I am sorry. I work hard. I pay everyone involved with me, as you well know, and I do it right. I do not want to be associated with scumbags who party their faces off, make promises they can't keep and then have the audacity to ask us for money to support them. Not only will I not support this shit, but I will do my best to point out that I am not in that business and it is bad for all of us.

[tony404]

When I asked my lawyer about this when it first happened. He said this isnt about porn its about pissing off the locals. I have a friend who is from Pensacola and says its a pretty uptight place.You have large companies in FL and they have no problems Score and Bang bus come to mind. its got to suck for them big time but if they were earning 10 mil they could of shot anywhere in the world they wanted.

[Hammer]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

I think that pretty much sums up what I said. I actually don't care if they shot their private orgies then put them on the net. My opinion still stands and what they did was wrong. This is not a first amendment case. It is a bunch of sleazebags getting laid, perhaps publishing the events, then trying to get us to support them. I am sorry. I work hard. I pay everyone involved with me, as you well know, and I do it right. I do not want to be associated with scumbags who party their faces off, make promises they can't keep and then have the audacity to ask us for money to support them. Not only will I not support this shit, but I will do my best to point out that I am not in that business and it is bad for all of us.

I don't disagree with you with you and I think people like this are bad for the business too but that's not what you said. lol

You said "i believe you are wrong on this. They had "parties" that had nothing to do with the website where girls were hired to fuck them and their friends."

And I said, no, the parties did have to do with the website and they were held to produce content for the website not just so they and their friends could get fucked.

[softball]

Originally Posted by Hammer

I don't disagree with you with you and I think people like this are bad for the business too but that's not what you said. lol

You said "i believe you are wrong on this. They had "parties" that had nothing to do with the website where girls were hired to fuck them and their friends."

And I said, no, the parties did have to do with the website and they were held to produce content for the website not just so they and their friends could get fucked.

Well we are agreeing on most of this. But what I heard was that the parties were just parties. So, it had nothing to do with filming and first amendment.

[MikeSouth]

Ray Guhn My Thoughts:
By MikeSouth

In the end the case wasn’t the precedent setting case it had the potential to be. It would have determined if shooting porn in Florida were legal or not and probably the entire 11th Circuit of which I am a part.

Ray was charged with Prostitution, Money Laundering and Drug related charges. This is more than enough to invoke the RICO statutes.

The prostitution charges stemmed from the fact that the prosecution was claiming that paying people to have sex is prostitution no matter who pays. The same reasoning used in the historic Hal Freeman case., where the 9th circuit courts ruled that paying people to make adult videos is NOT prostitution. This would have been the first time the theory has been tested outside the ninth circuit.

Bear in mind that Ray himself is a lawyer.

What likely happened is that Ray was offered a sweetheart deal on one charge, where he gets a low sentence of 3 to 5 years in a state prison. Rather than risk a trial where he gets convicted on any two of the three charges where he would face RICO sentencing and 15 -25 yrs he copped a plea.

Was it a smart move? I expect it was, there was a lot more at stake here than just making porn for Guhn. There was reportedly to be testimony that Guhn supplied drugs to the girls and that there were pay for play sessions AFTER the shoots were over. This kind of thing muddies the water a LOT.

In the end it really didn’t have the precedent setting possibilities because of the alleged criminal activity that surrounded the shoots that was unrelated to porn.

Word is that the real reason Ray got popped is because one of his inside guys turned on him.

[DannyCox]

Originally Posted by Hammer

One of their websites featured orgies (sex parties) so the allegation was that they had these sex parties for the purpose of producing content for the site, in which case, all performers should have been paid.

We used to hold huge orgy parties at our studios that we would film and also stream live on the 'net from different angles. The largest had 57 men and 11 women, and everyone was paid. The guys were all paid a token $20. and of course, had to supply proper ID which we photocopied and had to sign a release. Every large sex party we've ever done was run like that.

Too many guys in this industry think only with their cocks, and that's what gets them in trouble.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

Too many guys in this industry think only with their cocks, and that's what gets them in trouble.