An observation on the current business...

[softball]

I have noticed in the past few months on various boards...including Oprano, that there is a chill in the air. There is a lot of bickering over small issues and small sums. There is a lot of finger pointing at ex "partners" for various problems, failures, and scams. There is wave of insults and attempts to trash people's businesses (competition?). And there are a lot of cash programme failures, or businesses on the market at some very "attractive" prices. There seems to be a war in the content world with big undercutting sales. All in all a malaise in the porn world.
When anyone mentions the "downturn" in the economy, there are the usual "I'm kicking ass this month" responses, and maybe some are. However, more and more are agreeing. The specter of tube sites is everywhere. The same people that are bitching about them on one board, are asking for advice on how to start one or monetize them on another.
All in all it ain't pretty. For the first time ever, it kind of feels that the market is very, very oversold and there is a frenzy of panic.
This might be a little colourful, but I do feel a chill in the air.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

I have noticed in the past few months on various boards...including Oprano, that there is a chill in the air. There is a lot of bickering over small issues and small sums. There is a lot of finger pointing at ex "partners" for various problems, failures, and scams. There is wave of insults and attempts to trash people's businesses (competition?). And there are a lot of cash programme failures, or businesses on the market at some very "attractive" prices. There seems to be a war in the content world with big undercutting sales. All in all a malaise in the porn world.
When anyone mentions the "downturn" in the economy, there are the usual "I'm kicking ass this month" responses, and maybe some are. However, more and more are agreeing. The specter of tube sites is everywhere. The same people that are bitching about them on one board, are asking for advice on how to start one or monetize them on another.
All in all it ain't pretty. For the first time ever, it kind of feels that the market is very, very oversold and there is a frenzy of panic.
This might be a little colourful, but I do feel a chill in the air.

Sit back and enjoy the ride!
I am.

[Toby]

I think the observation is more or less accurate. There is definitely a thinning of the herd taking place, and not just in the adult biz.

Some will depart gracefully, others will go down in flames, and there's always some trying to find a way to make a quick buck on other's misfortune.

[helix]

As the profit margins get tight, the business's that run a tight ship will survive. The business's that employ a fast and sloppy business plan will die off, be absorbed, sell out etc..

Fresh from GFY
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=823774

[miz_wright]

I'm laothe to blame something like tube sites - for a lot of reasons, but primary among them is that every time there are economic uncertainties in the broader market, there are a few things that happen:

1) Shoppers begin looking more often at deep-discount items,
2) Small business owners have a harder time staying afloat,
3) Credit begins to tighten. and
4) Marktes as a whole contract and consolodate.

Why should adult be any different? and most everything that you mention (backbiting, etc) are very common when times are tight. And a lot fo the things I am seeing mentioned here I think are strongly attributable to the larger economic picture. It's tough to justify paying for porn when you're looking at paying $40 to fill an economy car - and much, much more if you drive anything with horsepower - and you are looking down the barrel of a tightening job market.

[softball]

Originally Posted by helix

As the profit margins get tight, the business's that run a tight ship will survive. The business's that employ a fast and sloppy business plan will die off, be absorbed, sell out etc..

Fresh from GFY
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=823774

Interesting thread.....

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Interesting thread.....

Traffic matters. Lets see how much it matters to some of Freeones sponsors.

[MRock]

Fuck it ... I'm expanding! It's never as bad as it's made out to be (the economy), and it's ony "bad" until another fiasco happens for some more sensational coverage. Here is an honest disclosure: Had a few more chargebacks than usual this month, but my sales are steady or up on all of my little gumball machines .... The coolest thing about being amateur is that it's just us, no partners or investors to answer to. The fray you refer is amusing and I'm gonna take a seat next to Gonzo to watch.

[softball]

Originally Posted by MRock

Fuck it ... I'm expanding! It's never as bad as it's made out to be (the economy), and it's ony "bad" until another fiasco happens for some more sensational coverage. Here is an honest disclosure: Had a few more chargebacks than usual this month, but my sales are steady or up on all of my little gumball machines .... The coolest thing about being amateur is that it's just us, no partners or investors to answer to. The fray you refer is amusing and I'm gonna take a seat next to Gonzo to watch.

Good luck to you.....the sand is just around the corner. You will recognize it by the number of guys with their heads buried in the pile.
I never said it was catastrophic, but there is a huge economic problem in the world at the moment. If Walmart is feeling it, everyone is feeling it.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

...there is a huge economic problem in the world at the moment. If Walmart is feeling it, everyone is feeling it.

[Forest]

Gonzo you fucking piece of shit you owe me a box of KK

Ill get you and your little dog too

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by Forest

Gonzo you fucking piece of shit you owe me a box of KK

Ill get you and your little dog too

You dont eat no KK any more Mr Egg White Omlette!

[Forest]

Originally Posted by gonzo

You dont eat no KK any more Mr Egg White Omlette!

darn foiled again

=(

[bluemoney]

"I'm kicking ass this month"

[softball]

Originally Posted by LizAEBN

I'm laothe to blame something like tube sites - for a lot of reasons, but primary among them is that every time there are economic uncertainties in the broader market, there are a few things that happen:

1) Shoppers begin looking more often at deep-discount items,
2) Small business owners have a harder time staying afloat,
3) Credit begins to tighten. and
4) Marktes as a whole contract and consolodate.

Why should adult be any different? and most everything that you mention (backbiting, etc) are very common when times are tight. And a lot fo the things I am seeing mentioned here I think are strongly attributable to the larger economic picture. It's tough to justify paying for porn when you're looking at paying $40 to fill an economy car - and much, much more if you drive anything with horsepower - and you are looking down the barrel of a tightening job market.

But porn is "recession proof".....lol
BTW, if you know anyone that needs a job, there is a huge labour shortage in Western Canada. Some businesses have gone under because they can't get staff. There are help wanted signs all over Vancouver and construction cranes everywhere. If you can hold a hammer you are working. However,its the American economy that unfortunately makes up a huge per centage of our business.

[softball]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

"I'm kicking ass this month"

Sorry....I am a little deef....you say you got your ass kicked this month?

[bluemoney]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Sorry....I am a little deef....you say you got your ass kicked this month?

Yes! . . . . .

You are most defiantly “deef”

[softball]

Originally Posted by bluemoney

Yes! . . . . .

You are most defiantly “deef”

Sorry, I couldn't here you. Would you mind speaking up?

[DannyCox]

Originally Posted by helix

As the profit margins get tight, the business's that run a tight ship will survive. The business's that employ a fast and sloppy business plan will die off, be absorbed, sell out etc..

Fresh from GFY
http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=823774

I just read through this thread and I can't believe the sheep just falling in line. Freeones wants everyone to pay them 70% because they are feeling the crunch....talk about short sighted idiots! Right there is your "fast and sloppy business plan", a company that just bounces really shit traffic around trying to dictate percentages to the sponsors they use to pay their bills. But the sad thing is, many of the sheep will fall for it. Not only are the sponsors working with a weak dollar, they will be get even less of it, and many think it's just fine.

Years ago, when the boys were swinging their dicks around, showing off about who could pay out more, and raising RevShare to 50%, I thought they were just plain crazy. It made no business sense whatsoever. Now we're hitting on 70% pay-outs! Madness, and a fully failing business model.

[softball]

But the sad thing is, many of the sheep will fall for it.

But Danny, that is just business. From what I saw, they will get what they want. Personally, I don't give a shit. They will be the first adopters of this, and ultimately it will kill the golden goose. However, many will make a killing out of adversity, and these guys are really fucking smart. But they have the converting traffic.

[DannyCox]

They don't really have converting traffic at all, they just manipulate a lot of it well. They throw enough at a program in hopes that some will stick. You'll get lots of traffic, but the conversion ratios are low. Lots of blinds and old fashioned circle jerk stuff.

But as I mentioned, they will get what they ask for as the sheep over at the zoo will just fall in line. A smart program would call them on it, and probably are in private. As we all know, real business is never done on the boards.

[softball]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

They don't really have converting traffic at all, they just manipulate a lot of it well. They throw enough at a program in hopes that some will stick. You'll get lots of traffic, but the conversion ratios are low. Lots of blinds and old fashioned circle jerk stuff.

But as I mentioned, they will get what they ask for as the sheep over at the zoo will just fall in line. A smart program would call them on it, and probably are in private. As we all know, real business is never done on the boards.

Shit I do all my business on the boards.....lol......
I do think, like I said, the first adopters will do ok. Its like the price of gasoline. They send it up to a buck thirty seven a liter and then we all think a buck twenty is a bargain. It is freeking altered reality. Sorry about the metric for our American friends, but gallons don't mean a lot to me anymore.

But I do think they crossed some lines. The good news is, a lot of people are going to disappear in the next six months and what is going to replace them will not be as good. I have never really thought that until now.

[helix]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

They don't really have converting traffic at all, they just manipulate a lot of it well. They throw enough at a program in hopes that some will stick. You'll get lots of traffic, but the conversion ratios are low. Lots of blinds and old fashioned circle jerk stuff.

But as I mentioned, they will get what they ask for as the sheep over at the zoo will just fall in line. A smart program would call them on it, and probably are in private. As we all know, real business is never done on the boards.

As the "sheep" knuckle under we will witness the thinning of the herd. Culling of the weak and feeble will be a good thing for the industry. Too many substandard paysites and unsustainable tube business models eating at the customer base for too long. I think this is just the beginning. We have already seen some consolidation and some absorption of minor sites to flesh out the niches of the smarter, bigger, well managed sites, ie DeeCash. I really think we will see a huge turnover and churning in the industry in the next few months. It will make for an interesting show for sure.

[DragonKing]

Chicken Little Rears His Little Ugly Head
Once Again ....


He makes more Cameos in this business than Puffy in a Bad Boy Video.

[miz_wright]

Originally Posted by rhetorical

But porn is "recession proof".....lol
BTW, if you know anyone that needs a job, there is a huge labour shortage in Western Canada. Some businesses have gone under because they can't get staff. There are help wanted signs all over Vancouver and construction cranes everywhere. If you can hold a hammer you are working. However,its the American economy that unfortunately makes up a huge per centage of our business.

*cracks up at "recession proof"*

Sure, it's a lagging indicator, but if people simply have got less money to spend (and let's face it: stateside, they do, and according to global market news, it's affecting other markets as well - much like the Japanese econ explosion back in '98 blew up Asia and Europe) - they are certainly going to prioritise where it's going. Teh pr0ns are going to be down that list a bit, typically.

I mean, I'm less willing to go out and buy the new issue of Club when my econobox takes $50 to fill with petrol, is all I'm sayin'.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by LizAEBN

*cracks up at "recession proof"*

Sure, it's a lagging indicator, but if people simply have got less money to spend (and let's face it: stateside, they do, and according to global market news, it's affecting other markets as well - much like the Japanese econ explosion back in '98 blew up Asia and Europe) - they are certainly going to prioritise where it's going. Teh pr0ns are going to be down that list a bit, typically.

I mean, I'm less willing to go out and buy the new issue of Club when my econobox takes $50 to fill with petrol, is all I'm sayin'.

We discuss all these issues at the safety meeting.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by DannyCox

They don't really have converting traffic at all, they just manipulate a lot of it well. They throw enough at a program in hopes that some will stick. You'll get lots of traffic, but the conversion ratios are low. Lots of blinds and old fashioned circle jerk stuff.

But as I mentioned, they will get what they ask for as the sheep over at the zoo will just fall in line. A smart program would call them on it, and probably are in private. As we all know, real business is never done on the boards.

Ahhhh Danny Cox wise man!
Why programs allow affiliates to dictate their business model is beyond me.
70% rev share --- only a MORON would give that away instead of going out and buying their own traffic.

I think affilaites got into this habit back with all the rules you had to follow to get your TGP listed with some of the post owners.

They lose sight of the fact that a post owner is there to make THEMSELVES money FIRST and anyone else DEAD LAST.

[Toby]

Originally Posted by gonzo

...They lose sight of the fact that a post owner is there to make THEMSELVES money FIRST and anyone else DEAD LAST.

As Tommy says, "1 for them, 2 for me."

[softball]

Originally Posted by DragonKing

Chicken Little Rears His Little Ugly Head
Once Again ....


He makes more Cameos in this business than Puffy in a Bad Boy Video.

I had a feeling this post too would reappear. However, this is a different situation than previous sky crashing situations. The US economy will prolly never recover its total dominance thanks to the last 8 years of breath taking spending. The dollar is weaker than its been in decades....if ever. Gas prices are approaching the scary numbers of the gas "crisis" of the 70's. All that is left to put the icing on the cake is inflation. I recall when the price of butter tripled in a month.
This time chicken little has a few more arrows in his quiver. The previous doomsayers were more worried about free porn and 2257 which was always a non starter in my books and I posted pretty much what you just said, DK. But there are bigger influences at work today. I don't think everything is going to crash and burn for everybody, but the heady days are over. The "soft" landing has arrived and this time, those who don't have good traffic and good product are facing some serious problems (I have always hated challenge as a euphemism).
So I don't think this is necessarily an "end of the world" observation, but times are not as optimistic and opportunities not as easily available, and yes only the strong will survive. You see I do believe in Darwin.

[softball]

Banner Headline in my local paper today was World Wide Food Crisis. Here is a bit of the article....

Soaring prices on everything from food to gasoline walloped consumers Thursday as the Bank of Canada warned of weaker economic growth to come -- new evidence the U.S. recession has deepened and is dragging down other sectors of the economy as it continues to slide.
Basic food items are becoming more scarce and the price of those commodities is soaring, matched only by the rapid increase in the cost of gasoline. Food shortages, hoarding by producing countries and a pernicious cycle of energy prices driving up production costs are only making the situation worse.
Maple Leaf Foods Inc., one of Canada's largest food processors, reported a loss on Thursday due to soaring costs for grain used in its bakeries and hog barns.
View Larger ImageA worker in Laos shows rice at a mill this week. The price of rice is up 50 per cent, triggering a crisis.





"These are stunningly, stunningly challenging and unique times," chief executive Michael McCain told shareholders at the company's annual meeting.
"The world is embroiled with absorbing the implications of the simple truth that food will be considerably more expensive, well into the future," he said.
Food riots have spread from Haiti to Thailand and panic buying has even hit North America -- Wal-Mart has imposed rice rationing in the United States because of shrinking supplies and Bruce Cran, president of the Consumers Association of Canada, said he was told that store shelves were being emptied of rice in British Columbia.

This state of fear is what is fueling Chicken Little and this time we all have to deal with it.

[Rcourt64]

The "I hope his dick still gets hard again tomorrow" sales strategies is
what your fuckers need to be looking at, not what the price of rice is...

[Robert]

Nitwit....

[miz_wright]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

The "I hope his dick still gets hard again tomorrow" sales strategies is
what your fuckers need to be looking at, not what the price of rice is...

He'll be yankin' his crank tomorrow, regardless. The question is: does he pay for the spank bank, or grab something free?

When the decision comes down between food or petrol, fewer will say "Oh, I'll totally shell out for the new PornStar Update."

'm pretty sure that was his point. But I may be mistaken.

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by LizAEBN

He'll be yankin' his crank tomorrow, regardless. The question is: does he pay for the spank bank, or grab something free?

When the decision comes down between food or petrol, fewer will say "Oh, I'll totally shell out for the new PornStar Update."

'm pretty sure that was his point. But I may be mistaken.

I'm sorry Liz, I disagree.

Addictions comes first before the kids eat in this country.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

The "I hope his dick still gets hard again tomorrow" sales strategies is
what your fuckers need to be looking at, not what the price of rice is...

Spelling, grammar, and sentence structure, should also be high on the list.

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Spelling, grammar, and sentence structure, should also be high on the list.

We don't need to know how to spell, we just gotta know how to drive trucks

[miz_wright]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Spelling, grammar, and sentence structure, should also be high on the list.

Oh, come now, EJ: Don't let's be ridiculous.

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by LizAEBN

Oh, come now, EJ: Don't let's be ridiculous.

See, your learning, I'll have your tomboy premadonna ass trained in no time.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

See, your learning, I'll have your tomboy premadonna ass trained in no time.

How much will you pay for this video on Liz dancing?

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by gonzo

How much will you pay for this video on Liz dancing?

Depends on what shes wearing while dancing

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

Depends on what shes wearing while dancing

It wasnt much

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by gonzo

It wasnt much

Oh? really??? ya im intersted then,
throw a number my way, and there better be some cleavage involved with this dancing

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

Oh? really??? ya im intersted then,
throw a number my way, and there better be some cleavage involved with this dancing

Ill throw in the full video of AJ doing his clown preformance too....

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Ill throw in the full video of AJ doing his clown preformance too....

I got a truck full of blow up mannequins that needs to be in Miami by 3pm.
and since I pulled over at the truck stop to play with them, I'm running late now. GOTTA ROOOLLLLLL !!!
So let me know how much?

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by LizAEBN

Oh, come now, EJ: Don't let's be ridiculous.

One can hope?....

[RawAlex]

The biggest issue facing the industry is poor grammar and a failure to use proper punctuation. If everyone did it right, we would all be billionaires.

Yes, this is the answer.

[Rcourt64]

AGAIN>>> cuz i feel like a broken record now, since we've been thru this before:

In a country that consist of spelling one word 5 different ways,
but pronounce it ALL the same way?
And where words spelled in one format but are pronounced or sentenced a TOTALLY different way. No where near the way spelt.
Then sorry people, I have no respect for your language from the get go.

[EmporerEJ]

Originally Posted by Rcourt64

AGAIN>>> cuz i feel like a broken record now, since we've been thru this before:

In a country that consist of spelling one word 5 different ways,
but pronounce it ALL the same way?
And where words spelled in one format but are pronounced or sentenced a TOTALLY different way. No where near the way spelt.
Then sorry people, I have no respect for your language from the get go.

Oh, that's all right...it's not easy to be an American. If it were, you could all be one of US. (Get the little pun, there?)
But, we like you anyhow. You keep working at it, and maybe, one day, we'll let you in!

[Rcourt64]

Originally Posted by EmporerEJ

Oh, that's all right...it's not easy to be an American. If it were, you could all be one of US. (Get the little pun, there?)
But, we like you anyhow. You keep working at it, and maybe, one day, we'll let you in!

GET BACK TO WORK DUDE


What progression have you to show these past few months ?

[Greg B]

I agree with Gonzo. We've both been around for over a decade at this biz.

What I'm seeing is like in any industry there are the incompetent and the greedy who fuck up things. It's that simple.

You have people who've made tons of money in this biz only to piss it away on dope and gambling and other stupid shit instead of putting things away for a rainy day.

I never did this full time because it was so easy. Only last 18 months or so I got attacked by some assholes who if you know the story are no longer in the biz. Their shit failed and several more now owe me money from court losses. Yes you have people undermining other people but that's why you have lawyers so they can go after the fuckheads.

I had to do diagnostics and damage control over the past year and it was fun. Found some new affiliates that actually convert, new strategies, new allies. I whittled everything down to the basics and to the bone so that the final responsibility would just be me and my artwork. It's never ever failed. I can now sit back and just draw toons and do little maintenance. I'm literally only a wee bit away from retiring on this income on a default basis.

In the meantime I don't sit on my ass I still look for the next way to make more capital.

I've found so many people in this biz are full of more shit than a constipated elephant. You find out when it's time to pay. I don't even deal with people who can't back up what they say. I've spent a good six figures on legals in the past few years straightening out a few assholes in this biz and more are on the way although they don't know it til it's too late.

It was high time I started cleaning house anyway.

So for me, one's status in this biz is in direct reflection to one's willingness to take responsibility for oneself.

Bottom line, it's who you hang out with.