32% of Americans

[XXXManager]

USS Liberty, and the espionage committed...

Do you trust "yourself"? Maybe you are self-skeptic as well? You think US security forces can not be associated with such things? If so - maybe the entire world - every country, including yours, can not be trusted? So you are "evenly" skeptical about all the countries in the world and all of them are just as bad (otherwise you would consider stick with the bad bunch when discussing things in this thread)? If so - what do YOU stand for?

I'm impressed with your ability to take that and use it to compare me to a spokesman for Arafat...

I am amazed by the way you get offended instead of understanding the similarities. You "plugged" Israel when I saw no connection to the thread. I will go and look again if there is any logical connection that required your input about Israel.. Maybe you think its just another Terror supporting country - and felt compelled to remind everyone how evil the regime there is.

I am far more worried about North Korea and an Asian arms race, about the India/Pakistan ... than I am about Lebanon, or Syria, or Iran.

Well. Your country leaderships and security and armed forces believe (since ever) otherwise. Maybe they know the facts? Or maybe it’s all about Oil? Or maybe they are puppets of Israel and sacrifice billions on billions and lives of US soldiers just to "fight Israel's war" because of the Zionist control over the US? or maybe everyone there is plain dumb and never in the last 30-40 years stopped to think maybe you are right?
Since you apparently disagree with the official US stand - I wish to believe you are smart enough to think something along the line of the last option.
(or maybe you are wrong there?)
little fact: Iran is the biggest financer of terrorism around the world - and the US

The threat presented to the United States by those countries has in fact diminished drastically

Your government and security forces think otherwise and I for one agree with them.

I am not the sort of fool who believes we can negotiate with terrorists or "understand their point of view," but I am also most definitely not interested in recruiting for them and continuing the conflict indefinitely by military incursions that will do absolutely nothing to solve the problem.

Fair enough. So what do you suggest?

Which brings me to alQaida ... I had to laugh when you said "You are basically admitting that the war in Iraq has nothing to do directly with alQaida. The connection is not as direct as you today think." Golly gee, you mean there isn’t a connection? Fuck, I've been screaming that for months

I didn't say that. not as such. I merely pointed out you self-admitted that’s what you think. I do actually think the connection is not as strong and automatic as US people were "educated" to believe - but I do believe there is a connection. Those people do not act in vaccume. They are not as dumb, isolated and incommunicative as you or others mght suggest. But - read my post and see I stated that you are being "educated" so that you go along with the plan that your leaderships want you to take (rightly so if you ask me). There is a connection as I said - which is terrorism. But since it seems some of your people have difficulties with indirect connections it has to be presented to you as very direct.

BTW ... if you stick around the board for a while you will find that I am far from being uncritical of my own country. Why, there are well-educated folks around here who can't decide if I'm a traitor, a defeatist, or just an all around menace to society.

That’s exactly my point. You have no country. You stand for nothing but secret ideals that no one knows what they are or what they call for. You only state that everyone else is wrong and bad. That’s not a very serious stand in a discussion.
If I summarize what you seem to be saying - it’s like that.
"Arab terrorism is bad. All terrorism is bad. The world is a bad place. BTW - ISRAEL's harmful acts against the US in the past are bad and I associate them with bad things. US aggression is (somewhat) bad. We should do the right thing. We should solve the real problem. We can not negotiate with terrorism but violence leads to violence. Let’s deal with the real threats."
You see? All of that means nothing really. You are a perfect being that does no evil. Very handy in a discussion – isn’t it? - but holds no water in real life. It’s like the pope’s stand.

In short, I understand fully well what you are saying - I just don't believe it. It's not a question of me not having a series of facts that you possess - it’s that I view the same facts as you do from a very different perspective and reject your conclusions.

Fair enough. We are allowed to disagree. That certain fact does not make any of us a bad person. If we all thought the same it would have been very boring




Last edited by XXXManager at Apr 12 2003, 01:19 PM