Mike South punks out Joanna Angel

[gonzo]

Hey Mike... you can quote me in your articles if you want. I aint scared!

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...annaangel.com/

You knew I was right when I told you that! Check out the rest of Mike's hellraising at mikesouth.com
--------------------------------------------------------------

Joanna Angel To direct for Club Jenna:
Dare we hope she knows anything about directing...nah. At a recent webmaster convention she was on a solo girl site panel. In her opening statement she said her site gets "millions of hits a day" The guy next to me leaned over and said "I didn't know she owned google"

What an idiotic thingto say to a convention of adult webmasters...who know better.
Ya wanna know why porn sucks and and is down 30 or more percent fromlast year? look no further than the LONG list of so called directors who dont know jack shit.

[KevinG]

*SIGH*

I don't even know why I waste my time replying to this, but here goes.

1. First of all, there is no statistic which matters more than your bank account balance.

I don't know for sure, but my guess is that Joanna has many of the people beaten on that one, including myself, Gonzo and Mike South combined.

2. In my opinion, out of all the statistical measurement tools out there, Alexa is one of the most useless and meaningless.

3. The first two points are my opinions. However, it is a FACT that Joanna is an AVN Award Winning director. Reading this post you would think otherwise.

Lastly, regarding the comment about how many hits the web site gets. She probably said that because she is so used to talking to the mainstream media, and that is how we provide them statistics.

We made our decision to quote "hits" to the mainstream, even though we know as professional Internet business people that "hits" are meaningless, but the mainstream media eats up big numbers.

I think it's also safe to say that Joanna gets way more mainstream publicity than most porn performers, writers and directors.

She has been featured in:

The New York Times, The Village Voice, Time Out New York, The New York Press, Esquire UK, Penthouse, SCREW, XBIZ, AVN, Fleshbot, HEEB and The New York Post, which featured her as one of its "Top 25 Sexiest NYers".

She was also a featured sex columnist for Spin Magazine in 2006.

Joanna also holds a B.A. in English from Rutgers University.

And, again, it doesn't matter how many hits or unique visitors you get, unless you make sales.

Here's one of the most impressive stats, imo, for http://joannaangel.com

Fifty percent of our members rebill 5 to 6 months in a row.

[KevinG]

I should mention that I am Joanna's webmaster, in charge of online marketing and traffic.

She also owns http://www.burningangel.com as well, which is a very unique site.

Oh, and back to Mike South for a moment:

Mike South's Alexa. 1,128,632

And have you ever seen any of Mike's dvd's? I guess he thinks he's a pretty good director. lol

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by KevinG

I should mention that I am Joanna's webmaster, in charge of online marketing and traffic.

She also owns http://www.burningangel.com as well, which is a very unique site.

Oh, and back to Mike South for a moment:

Mike South's Alexa. 1,128,632

And have you ever seen any of Mike's dvd's? I guess he thinks he's a pretty good director. lol

I havent seen one of Mikes DVD's. But I do own a copy of Repenetrator.

[KevinG]

Come on now Kevin... you know she fucked up on that one just like she told all the newbies that the most important thing to do was to shoot content for 3 years instead of worrying about traffic.

1. I stand by my explanation about quoting hits and do not agree that she "fucked up", but you are entitled to your perception and opinion.

Also, if you get to know Joanna, and also have experience dealing with other porn girls, you would know that she is probably one of the most educated and intelligent of the bunch.

2. Regarding the content vs. traffic debate that arose at Cybernet, I will concede a little bit to you that she did mis-speak a little.

She didn't get the chance to correct herself in public.

She later corrected herself in private conversation, with Hammer standing there to hear it as well.

Her opinion of content vs. traffic is that, hypothetically, if you are new to the business and you have $100,000 to invest, Joanna advises that you budget about $60 - $70,000 of that towards producing your own exclusive, high quality, unique content.

I happen to agree.

I am in charge of generating traffic for BurningAngel.com and JoannaAngel.com, so you know I understand the importance of traffic.

So ... wtf do I send traffic to if there is no content.

And ... more important than that ... in my experience, I have had the greatest success in building the highest quality and highest quantity of traffic when there is a high quantity of very good exclusive content.

Here's the point:

IMO, Content comes first, then traffic. There's always a means to generate traffic if you have great content.

Anyone can disagree, but if they do, it would lead me to believe they do not really know how to generate traffic.

Not to be ranked in the top 100 thousand in Alexa tells me she aint getting millions of hits a day.

I will see what I can do to get some Chinese traffic for her.

Seriously though, it is a huge waste of time to discuss Alexa.

Alexa is quite useless if you dont know how to read those stats.

Alexa is quite useless PERIOD.

IMHO Page Rank is the most over rated and useless stat out there but we will agree to disagree.

I think you are saying that because you know me as a professional SEO, and most professional SEO people worship Google PageRank like you seem to worship Alexa.

However, let me tell you what one of my comments were to the audience when I sat on the traffic panel.

I said, "Google Page Rank means next to nothing and Alexa Rank means less than nothing."

At least we agree on something, and here is a little side note trivia for you.

Google doesn't own PageRank. Stanford University owns it and it is licensed to Google until 2011.

But I do own a copy of Repenetrator.

That's the smartest thing you said in this post ;-)

[gonzo]

I bet Im laughing about this harder than you are.

[Hammer]

Joanna is a very unique case and my concern in the newbie seminar was that her comment didn't apply to 99% of the newbies in that room. Suggesting that the average newbie needs to shoot his/her own exclusive content only applies if that newbie cares to be his own producer (most do not), or, as in her case, that newbie is going to be his/her own content (most do not).

IMO, before any newbie starts shooting his own content, especially 3 years worth, it would be a good idea to see if he/she even has what it takes to learn how to generate traffic to an adult site in the first place. Why waste time and money shooting a bunch of exclusive content if you don't know you can sell it?

The smart thing to do would be to promote someone else's sites until you think you understand what you're doing and then, if you want to produce your own content, start shooting it. Of course, that means I disagree pretty much completely, because in most cases I think traffic is far more important than content. I know plenty of webmasters that are making lots of money promoting some pretty shitty sites.

p.s. As for the Mike South comment, I'm going to stay out of that, because I know that Kevin knows what he's doing and I'm sure her site is doing quite well.

[gonzo]

Come on now Kevin... you know she fucked up on that one just like she told all the newbies that the most important thing to do was to shoot content for 3 years instead of worrying about traffic.

The arguement that content is the single most important thing when building a new site just isnt accurate when you consider the difficulty in getting traffic to sites these days. Joanna is lucky that the media considers her unique in the industry. Not to be ranked in the top 100 thousand in Alexa tells me she aint getting millions of hits a day.
That was pure uninformed bullshit. And I know thats what she said because I made the comment to South.

Porn directing . . . beats me. But I do know that its the AVN award winning Mike South. Ill let you 2 decide that one. The video guys and gals sure do have egos these days. Personally I think an AVN award equates to an Xbiz award ... no one really gives a shit.

Alexa is quite useless if you dont know how to read those stats.
IMHO Page Rank is the most over rated and useless stat out there but we will agree to disagree.

That all being said. If she is retaining 5-6 months then in the end thats the only stat that any of us need to worry about.

Im glad you replied and I look forward to promoting that site once I have a traffic source matured.

[KevinG]

Originally Posted by gonzo

If she is retaining 5-6 months then in the end thats the only stat that any of us need to worry about.

Im glad you replied and I look forward to promoting that site once I have a traffic source matured.

I look forward to seeing how much traffic and conversions you can send.

Her affiliate program is here: http://joannabling.com

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by KevinG

I look forward to seeing how much traffic and conversions you can send.

Her affiliate program is here: http://joannabling.com

I dont worship Alexa either... but Im mighty fond of google ad words.