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Originally Posted by PornoDoggy
CD - I was not calling you a fool personally. You don't have kids, so you can't know how your attitude toward child rearing will change when you do. You strike me as an intelligent person, so I'd be quite suprised if your attitudes didn't.
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I agree with you in part that there is a difference between raising your own kids and having years of experience with the kids of others, etc. Although not directly my own, my family does have plenty of kids, thus I have numerous neices and nephews, even a small flock of great-nieces and nephews. I have had a small hand in looking after them to the tune of many years. I was also in the Big Brothers of Canada organization for several years back in the mid-to-late 80's.
And I have eyes and ears... and they all work.
Drawing from my own childhood experience I just know that I was raised a certain way, and I know that were I to have kids of my own I would raise them in that same spirit, because I truly was blessed with two great caring parents who did not put up with a lot of shit from us and weren't afraid to draw the line, yet were nonetheless loving and set good examples.
I should add here about corporal punishment that it was rarely the first punishment us kids received. Often you'd be told several times to behave, and even sent to your room on occasion.... but some behavior warrants more sever consequences, especially repetitive and utter defiantly bad behavior, and for that we got spanked. Believe me, we didn't like it.
Do any of us kids now harbor an ill will towards our parents? Not a chance. In my adult years I have thanked my parents for caring enough to swat my bratty ass, which brings me to your second point....
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Originally Posted by PornoDoggy
I don't buy it. If you check literature from at least the time it switched from stone carvings to papyrus, you will find the same lament. From personal experience, I have heard my own father say it about my generation, his mother reminding him that she and grandpa said the same thing about his generation - and have now heard my own daughter make a similar grumble about her son.
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Things just seem a bit different now that there is no meaningful punishment allowed in schools, and with so many single parents out there, AND with so many parents out there letting their kids run rampant.
What about 12 and 13 yr old girls getting piercings and tats, WTF is up with that?
You can't deny that teen car thefts aren't way up compared to what it was 20 years ago. I hear this confirmed on the news often here, have even had a few attempts made at my own vehicle in recent years. Some kids were caught taking a hammer to my bike lock a few years back, a 15 yr old and a 16 yr old... and yeah, like a disgruntled old fucker I get a bit peeved and ask out loud "Where are the fucking parents?" and yes it does occur to me that there are a lot of kids out there being raised with no fear of reprisals, no fear or respect at all when an adult tells them that what they are doing is wrong, and these kids are growing up to be utter jerks.
Again, not all... but a lot. Were there jerks back when I was a kid? Of course there were. Just not this many, and.... listen up... when an adult came by and yelled at a kid for doing something stupid, back then the kid would normally be afraid of reprisals and would listen to the adult, because you did not want a spanking and you did not want your dad to spank you for it either. Nowadays more often than not you have kids.... even little kids.... telling an adult to "fuck off asshole, you can't touch me fuckface".... because they know that one call to CFS or word to a teacher or counselor and that adult is under investigation for child abuse or even arrested.
It wasn't like that 20 - 30 - 40 years ago.
Look man, I am not sitting here trying to tell you or anyone you're doing it all wrong do it this way. I am simply stating there is a problem, a large one in fact, maybe not with your kids but with a lot of other kids and a lot of parents and in the system. That's all. I understand we won't all see eye to eye about how to raise our children, I would never presume to expect that. But what we can do is at least admit that problems exist in society with respect to this issue, and talk about what might be causing the problems and throw out some thoughts towards finding solutions.