Originally Posted by fusionx

Who would be the best outsourcing company to use for simple HTML work like basic templates, and maybe some light customer service, like assisting newbies with CGI permissions, etc?

No phone calls required, just e-mail, IM and message board support stuff..

Originally Posted by fusionx

lol - I learned that lesson!

Originally Posted by gonzo

Im sure the sig whore's boardtracker are all going off. Just think before monday you will have all sorts of... responses for you to "hit them up".

Every project Ive outsourced to any company in that country goes something like this...

First 3 weeks...excellent. Fast and furious service and worth what you pay for it.

2nd Month - Im sorry My hard drive crashed. Would you like to rent server space so that I have a back up of all your work?

- Sorry. I didnt get your email. Can you resend to this address.

- Its a holiday here I wont be in the office for the next 3 days.

3rd month
-Sorry I didnt get your email with the changes. Can you resend to this address?

-I have to take my sister to the hospital today I wont be able to do those changes.

-My computer has a virus. Would you like to rent server space so that I can have a back up of all your work?

-Its a holiday here I will be out of the office for 2 days.

4th month
-Some one stole my computer with all of your work on it. Would you like to rent server space so I can have a back up of all your work?

-My grandmother died. I will be out of the office today.

-Its a festival here all week. I wont be in the office.

-Sorry our office email isnt working. I didnt recieve the changes and my ICQ is offline.

How close is this to your experience?

Originally Posted by gonzo

No one in the Phillipines.

Originally Posted by XOS_Andrei_G

Ouch. Which company did you use anyway? It's a bit wrong to generalize like that. Although I don't disagree with what you just posted (unfortunately) but some people in the Philippines (especially freelancers) do take the work seriously. There are companies that don't actually practice the whole Philippine holiday thing (because it's only an option to) and have better HR rotations.

Originally Posted by XOS_Andrei_G

Ouch. Which company did you use anyway? It's a bit wrong to generalize like that. Although I don't disagree with what you just posted (unfortunately) but some people in the Philippines (especially freelancers) do take the work seriously. There are companies that don't actually practice the whole Philippine holiday thing (because it's only an option to) and have better HR rotations.

Originally Posted by gonzo

Im sure the sig whore's boardtracker are all going off. Just think before monday you will have all sorts of... responses for you to "hit them up".

Every project Ive outsourced to any company in that country goes something like this...

First 3 weeks...excellent. Fast and furious service and worth what you pay for it.

2nd Month - Im sorry My hard drive crashed. Would you like to rent server space so that I have a back up of all your work?

- Sorry. I didnt get your email. Can you resend to this address.

- Its a holiday here I wont be in the office for the next 3 days.

3rd month
-Sorry I didnt get your email with the changes. Can you resend to this address?

-I have to take my sister to the hospital today I wont be able to do those changes.

-My computer has a virus. Would you like to rent server space so that I can have a back up of all your work?

-Its a holiday here I will be out of the office for 2 days.

4th month
-Some one stole my computer with all of your work on it. Would you like to rent server space so I can have a back up of all your work?

-My grandmother died. I will be out of the office today.

-Its a festival here all week. I wont be in the office.

-Sorry our office email isnt working. I didnt recieve the changes and my ICQ is offline.

How close is this to your experience?

Originally Posted by rhetorical

There are certain nationalities I will not do business with. Just like Visa. Russians, Nigerians, Filipinos. I am sure you guys could add a few more to this list. But these guys are at the top of mine...in that order.

Originally Posted by Matt Collins

I don't know what companies you guys are talking about, but I have used iwebmasters for over a year now and I love my guys.

Matt

Originally Posted by Matt Collins

I don't know what companies you guys are talking about, but I have used iwebmasters for over a year now and I love my guys.

Of course, the iWebmaster guys would tell you that they are staff leasing and not outsourcing.

I have four employees doing everything from system administration to programming to web design.

Also, iWebmasters is owned by Rick Latona and Dee and they run a quality company.

While results may vary, I can only speak to my opinion and I have nothing but good things to say about these guys.

Matt

Originally Posted by fusionx

Hi Matt - got time for a phone call tomorrow? Want to follow up on the RevShareHosting thing we talked about a while ago.

Originally Posted by Matt Collins

Sure I would love to chat, give me a call at 404-214-6070. If you don't get me, hit me up on ICQ or email me at matt @ revsharehosting.com and let me know when you are free.

Gonzo, I am not sure you are qualified to make such a broad statement as "all outsourcing sux". Maybe your experience with it sucks, but I am proof that you are wrong, since I am very happy with my outsourcing experience.

Matt

Originally Posted by gonzo

The first letters spell out who I was talking about ... AOS.
Im glad its worked out for you but there are several of us that it hasnt worked out for.

As the saying goes... your results may vary.

Originally Posted by Matt Collins

Sure I would love to chat, give me a call at 404-214-6070. If you don't get me, hit me up on ICQ or email me at matt @ revsharehosting.com and let me know when you are free.

Gonzo, I am not sure you are qualified to make such a broad statement as "all outsourcing sux". Maybe your experience with it sucks, but I am proof that you are wrong, since I am very happy with my outsourcing experience.

Matt

Originally Posted by spazlabz

Enlighten me please
Russians - why
Nigerians - I think I know but... why
Filipinos - why

in defense of a lot of Filipinos that I have worked with some of them do outstanding work. My biggest problem with them has been a consistant lack of following instructions. After working with a group of them very closely for over a year I developed a style of communication that was remarkable. I found myself describing the work that needed to be done down to the absolute smallest detail
and I would repeat myself several times in the instructions on the more important things... over and over and over... they still 'forgot'

But not all of them are like that and some do extremely good work for a price that is very affordable.


spaz

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Russians are nearly all crooks. I am sure there are a few honest ones, but I did say rule of thumb. Up to you if you want to take the chance.
Flips?
Well, you actually answered your own question.

Originally Posted by fusionx

Who would be the best outsourcing company to use for simple HTML work like basic templates, and maybe some light customer service, like assisting newbies with CGI permissions, etc?

No phone calls required, just e-mail, IM and message board support stuff..

Originally Posted by spazlabz

not only did i answer my own question, I contradicted myself in the very same reply... that's the thing about Filipinos, some are pure gold, seriously, they love what they do and take pride in a job they have done well... I respect that. Others are lying, lazy sloths that honestly believe as soon as you hire them you OWE them a paycheck whether they work or not.
I had one guy turn around and give me one of the best tours we had on a program i used to work for in 2 days. Had another worthless pile of shit take 2 months to make a flash menu that we ended up trashing... and he said he could do flash in the first place. It's a crap shoot but i was interested in hearing your reply.

As for Russians, I am currently employed by some guys over in the Ukraine and if they are crooks they are ones that treat me with respect, listen to my opinions and value them... and they pay on time :D


spaz

Originally Posted by JR

also... just a general answer for people to think about since the idea of "cheap labor" seems real enticing BUT usually results in headaches and lost money.


i think design is an issue seperate from all other issues. its the simplest issue to deal with. otherwise, you are basically talking about hiring an employee for other needs.. WITHOUT the benefit of an interview, a resume and talking to them at all. you are taking someone elses word that this person can fulfill all your needs to a T because you have no idea.

my personal advice from experience of managing many people remotely is to ease into it...be ready that its going to be a fuck story every time until you have some time to find the person that works for you. you can't even begin to grasp the frustration of communication issues that are waiting for you. you really can't. its going to be bad if you are looking for an ongoing relationship. everything is going to seem simple to you, clear, straightforward and the other person is going to be telling you every step of the way that they "get it" - they wont most of the time. lost money. lost time. lost customers.

i speak russian so i frequently work with a lot of russians and ukrainians and do so without problem. it took a lot of trial and error and being fluent in both languages did not make communication much easier since the whole business, porn, making a sale etc etc etc on the web is still for the most part, going to be a foreign concept to them.

like any employee/employer relationship, it begins with hiring well... if you don't have the benefit of an interview, of talking to that person about their experiences, seeing samples of their work, learning about their character and personality... in the real world NO ONE would hire someone under those circumstances.

start slow.... test the waters. don't make a serious comittment to anyone (all the idiots in the philippines seem to be big fans of the hard sell - a BIG red light). if you do, you will screw yourself and regret it.

Originally Posted by gonzo

I direct this to both Matt and JR.
The initial appeal of oursourcing at least for me wasn't the cheap labor.

I honestly dont trust MOST design firms in this industry.

I do not trust them with my exclusive content.
I do not trust them with my design concepts and ideas.

...and finally I can not trust them not to use my stuff as a template to be reused for the next client.

This industry is very small in terms of people running their mouth. If you dont believe it... watch the next drama thread on GFY and see how many cocksuckers chime in to say that they know whats going on but they said they wouldnt tell.

That is why I sought out work to be outsourced.

Originally Posted by XOS_Andrei_G

Ouch. Which company did you use anyway? It's a bit wrong to generalize like that. Although I don't disagree with what you just posted (unfortunately) but some people in the Philippines (especially freelancers) do take the work seriously. There are companies that don't actually practice the whole Philippine holiday thing (because it's only an option to) and have better HR rotations.

Originally Posted by Forest

I employee 5 guys in the PI

I have to say I have rarely ever had a problem with productivity

Originally Posted by fusionx

Who would be the best outsourcing company to use for simple HTML work like basic templates, and maybe some light customer service, like assisting newbies with CGI permissions, etc?

No phone calls required, just e-mail, IM and message board support stuff..

Originally Posted by qUeenBeE

If you're still looking...

fusionx, We have 2 guys who can handle that job. You can always choose between them. NO setup fees, NO contract, NO hidden charges, hit me up lets talk more.


p.s. We work with adult and mainstream websites. We have great & responsible managers behind the company. Give us a chance to earn your business, cheers!:)

Originally Posted by qUeenBeE

If you're still looking...

fusionx, We have 2 guys who can handle that job. You can always choose between them. NO setup fees, NO contract, NO hidden charges, hit me up lets talk more.


p.s. We work with adult and mainstream websites. We have great & responsible managers behind the company. Give us a chance to earn your business, cheers!:)

Originally Posted by Hell Puppy

Will you hire 'em out and accept payment at the end of a month's work instead of in advance?

That's the only way I'd ever touch offshore stuff again. It restores their incentive to actually deliver what they promise they can.

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Why on earth would you ever pay for something in advance? That is a no brainer.
You actually did that?

Originally Posted by gonzo

I thought you had all Ruskies?
Have you got a website up yet?

Originally Posted by rhetorical

Why on earth would you ever pay for something in advance? That is a no brainer.
You actually did that?

Originally Posted by Jon12345 (Post 780254)

Anyone here happy to have a chat with me on any of the messengers about outsourcing to the Philippines's (or maybe elsewhere). I am looking to do this imminently. AIM/ICQ/MSN/Yahoo are all good with me.

Originally Posted by Jon12345 (Post 780262)

Yes, some people think its ok some don't.