Really? So a 4 year old should be able to drive? Outstanding!

Who's God?

This question is meant in every possible sense

HAHA Bush tossed out some red meat!!

Us dogs liked it....

Woof woof!

:D[/b][/quote]
Uhhhh ... red meat or red herring?

I'm sure you did love it, Mike. Long on rhetoric, short on substance, not too many big words, pressing all the hot buttons ... ideal stump speech full of patriotism by rote designed to appeal to a great many people who call themselves conservatives.

I really do want him to make a lot more like that.

I have to admit though, Mike - you did make me smile.

Kinda like Tiny Tim's greatest hits.

Who's God?

This question is meant in every possible sense[/b][/quote]
Why, Mine, of course.

Why, Mine, of course.[/b][/quote]
The God. The creator of the Universe.

The God who tells me that anyone to the left of McCarthy should be shot.

A+

The God. The creator of the Universe.

The God who tells me that anyone to the left of McCarthy should be shot.[/b][/quote]
Buffama bin Laden?

Buffama bin Laden?[/b][/quote]
:)

Anyway, back to a more serious note:

PD, are you honestly saying that all those judges are merely interpreting the constitution? By your definition, is there any possible ruling a judge could make which could not be defined under your semantics as interpretation but rather could be defined as "legislating from the bench?"



Last edited by Buff at Jan 21 2004, 11:39 AM

I truly believe that folks with these views should stick to flossing those all mighty superstitious divine books on religion and leave decision making to people with their beliefs based on facts.

Human rights are not bestowed by God, they are bestowed by educated leaders. God can't bestow anything because God is just a belief in ignorance.

Why should anyone care if fags and dykes get the same rights as hetros? Does this somehow make marriage less divine? Get over it, there is no god and marriage is nothing more then a legal agreement between to people in love.

Uhhhh ... red meat or red herring?

I'm sure you did love it, Mike. Long on rhetoric, short on substance, not too many big words, pressing all the hot buttons ... ideal stump speech full of patriotism by rote designed to appeal to a great many people who call themselves conservatives.

I really do want him to make a lot more like that.

I have to admit though, Mike - you did make me smile.

Kinda like Tiny Tim's greatest hits.[/b][/quote]


Of course it was long on rhetoric and short on detials PD it was a State of the Union address. It is a big pep rally - nothing more, nothing less.

I think you might have missed a spot.... I can tell you were getting a little frothy around your mouth! hahaha

I truly believe that folks with these views should stick to flossing those all mighty superstitious divine books on religion and leave decision making to people with their beliefs based on facts.

Human rights are not bestowed by God, they are bestowed by educated leaders. God can't bestow anything because God is just a belief in ignorance.

Why should anyone care if fags and dykes get the same rights as hetros? Does this somehow make marriage less divine? Get over it, there is no god and marriage is nothing more then a legal agreement between to people in love.[/b][/quote]


HAHAH Cleo, you would do well in Communism. Might I suggest you head to China or North Korea.... there are countries that beleive human rights come from men, not from God!

I guess you have not spent much time in history or philosophy classes....

Oh and for the non-beleivers out there - it can be any God. It is a concept you should try to understand.

I truly believe that folks with these views should stick to flossing those all mighty superstitious divine books on religion and leave decision making to people with their beliefs based on facts.

Human rights are not bestowed by God, they are bestowed by educated leaders. God can't bestow anything because God is just a belief in ignorance.

Why should anyone care if fags and dykes get the same rights as hetros? Does this somehow make marriage less divine? Get over it, there is no god and marriage is nothing more then a legal agreement between to people in love.[/b][/quote]
You live in a country which grew out of a revolution against the English Crown, a revolution based on the proposition that human rights are bestowed by the Creator and not men.

But let me guess, you're better educated than Patrick Henry, Samuel Adams, and Thomas Jefferson? Those ignorant bastards! Hahahahaha

HAHAH Cleo, you would do well in Communism. Might I suggest you head to China or North Korea.... there are countries that beleive human rights come from men, not from God!

I guess you have not spent much time in history or philosophy classes....

Oh and for the non-beleivers out there - it can be any God. It is a concept you should try to understand.[/b][/quote]
MikeAI it must be hard to type with one hand waving the flag and the other flossing the bible.

Samuel Adams??!! how about Thomas Paine?

A+[/b][/quote]
Thank you, sir! ;-))

MikeAI it must be hard to type with one hand waving the flag and the other flossing the bible.[/b][/quote]
Flag - YES.

Bible - while I consider myself religious and I do beleive in God. I think that human beings are so flawed that when they orginize into groups that the dynamics automaticly make these institutions flawed.


I know you intended this to be an insult, and in your group it is ( kinda like you calling me a straight man ) but to me it is a badge of honor.

:salute:

Samuel Adams??!! how about Thomas Paine?[/b][/quote]
Adams was da bomb, yo! But Pat Henry was the real bad ass.

This is probably the most ignorant thing you have ever uttered.

And, it has nothing to do with whether you believe in God or not.

Adams was da bomb, yo! But Pat Henry was the real bad ass.[/b][/quote]
Yo, Yo, Yo let me speak on this
I B Kickin it wit TJ

Yep. That's what I'm saying. And yes, I do believe that there are situations where judges have "legislated from the bench", and no, I don't think that is appropriate.

The "judicial activist" charge made some sense back in the days of convoluted court-ordered busing schemes (which made liberals feel good while diverting attention from real issues of employement and housing discrimination) and the like.

However, like the use of liberal as a perjorative, the phrase has made its way into the verbal arsenal of the right. Like Rev. Bush's lament about the "discrimination" against religion (which made me laugh out loud) last night, it's usually employed by people to descirbe any decision that they disagree with.

I'm also going to admit something that few who are decrying the Massachusetts court decision will - I have not read the Massachusetts decision personally. FROM WHAT I HAVE READ AND HEARD, it was not judicial activism as I understand it.

So what you are saying is that anyone with a world view based on information or attitudes not prevelant in the 1770s is suspect?

And what group would that be? You imply disparity on my part with the human race where non exists. I'm human, that is the only group that I'm part of.

I'm just along for the ride in this rip in space time that we call reality. I don't have any illusions that I'm any kind of creature created by some kind of omnipotent being.

Yeah our nation was founded by people who wanted more then to live under the rule of a dictatorship. I'm lucky to live in what I believe to be the greatest nation every conceived, but just as it was created by imperfect beings it is an imperfect nation still evolving. When we start seeking answers to our issues in ancient beliefs based on superstition we stop evolving.

The founders of the US were great people with great ideas, but lets not forget that they also believed in evil spirits, witches, and a bunch of other ignorant beliefs. Using their beliefs we should start going out and finding some witches to burn and perform exorcisms on those pesky evil-doers.

And what group would that be? You imply disparity on my part with the human race where non exists. I'm human, that is the only group that I'm part of.

I'm just along for the ride in this rip in space time that we call reality. I don't have any illusions that I'm any kind of creature created by some kind of omnipotent being.

Yeah our nation was founded by people who wanted more then to live under the rule of a dictatorship. I'm lucky to live in what I believe to be the greatest nation every conceived, but just as it was created by imperfect beings it is an imperfect nation still evolving. When we start seeking answers to our issues in ancient beliefs based on superstition we stop evolving.

The founders of the US were great people with great ideas, but lets not forget that they also believed in evil spirits, witches, and a bunch of other ignorant beliefs. Using their beliefs we should start going out and finding some witches to burn and perform exorcisms on those pesky evil-doers.[/b][/quote]


You are coming around Cleo - I can just feel it.

:D

Do not confuse me with supporting religious zealots - or zealots of any kind. Anytime there is money or power involved, you can expect to see the worst in human behavior. That is why organized religion in many ways fails....

OMG, MikeAI and my Cleo persona almost having the same beliefs, did proverbial hell freeze over? :D

Now if something can be done about that FUCKING BANNER that has some guy screaming whatever it is he is screaming which has caused all of Starbucks to turn around and look at me while I'm sipping my latte and posting on a board.

I agree with you on the banner - I almost pissed on myself last night when I moused over it.

Hoop - help us - give us a non-sounds banner to replace the old one with! :D

We have bipartisan support for it!!

So what you are saying is that anyone with a world view based on information or attitudes not prevelant in the 1770s is suspect?[/b][/quote]
Nope. I am saying the notion that our human rights are derived from God and not man is not an ignorant one as someone else claimed.

And what group would that be? You imply disparity on my part with the human race where non exists. I'm human, that is the only group that I'm part of.

I'm just along for the ride in this rip in space time that we call reality. I don't have any illusions that I'm any kind of creature created by some kind of omnipotent being.

Yeah our nation was founded by people who wanted more then to live under the rule of a dictatorship. I'm lucky to live in what I believe to be the greatest nation every conceived, but just as it was created by imperfect beings it is an imperfect nation still evolving. When we start seeking answers to our issues in ancient beliefs based on superstition we stop evolving.

The founders of the US were great people with great ideas, but lets not forget that they also believed in evil spirits, witches, and a bunch of other ignorant beliefs. Using their beliefs we should start going out and finding some witches to burn and perform exorcisms on those pesky evil-doers.[/b][/quote]
Do you have any reference sources which demonstrate that our founding fathers believed in witches and evil spirits? This I would love to see.

Just a note - don't go looking for something unless you're prepared to find it.
Looking for witches to burn at the stake might not be an endeavor you want to carry the banner for. :awinky:

The human species has evolved quite adequately with religion - some could argue those "superstitions" have been a primary factor in that evolution. Equal treatment, eutopia blah blah is not the ends of evolution nor even a means that I've ever heard - evolution is simply survival of the species.

Just like platonists "believe" mathematical objects actually exist, scientists believe "causation" exists and the religious believe a "divine" exists. Damn DeCartes - he fucked things up for the "non superstitious".

The new southern evangelical empiricists will dominate...

best of luck -
aeon

It is thanks to men who believed in a power higher than "His Highness, King George III" that we enjoy the freedoms we have today.

WE hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights

Had they thought that things began and ended with old Georgy-boy, we simply wouldn't be here. They would've simply accepted their lot in life and sighed a little deeper as they mucked on about their way.

Oh Jesus,

that was one of the most boring state of the union speeches I have seen in years.

cut it in 1/2 you say, LOL. Just to make up for the job losses since he took office, our economy would have to produce around 245,000 new jobs each quarter. Ending in December, we produced 1,000 new jobs.

Faith Based funding sucks in my opinion, whether it's Jewish, Christian, Muslim, etc.

I am glad Dean is burning his own election. I like him on some social policies, but I know and have known he can not be elected, especially in 2004.

It will be Kerry, Clark or Edwards. I hope it's a Kerry - Clark Ticket, or mabey Kerry - Edwards ticket. We need a good, likeable Southern person on the ticket. No Dem can win without taking at least 3-4 southern states. No even the repubs admit if Graham was on the ticket as VP we could probably take Florida, but even know I love Graham, he doesn't articulate and speak the best always...

Bush might have 55-60% approval ratings right now, but so did Daddy bush at this time. He can be beat if we keep pushing our points and differences with his admin.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned his call to renew the Patriot Act, or the burst of applause when he said it was expiring.

I watched the speech streamed from the MSNBC site this morning at 3am, so I got the "stare at Bush 100% of the time" camera; didn't get to see who clapped and who sat on their hands, who made faces, whatever. I was also saved from the snide comments from Anchors who feel their words are more important than the President's though, and who insert comments during the speech. It was great. Almost like watching a football game without that annoying fat fucktard John Madden.

Carrie,

the 1984 big brother act is a total sham. I was so elated when dems clapped after bush said it was expiring.

I hope it doesn't get to a vote this election year :(

Honestly, me too.
If it expires it'll be harder to bring back than if they simply renew it in time. It'll have to go through from start to finish again.

Did he mention any "faith based initiatives" this time?

It's election season... who's betting on a one term president?

Alex



Last edited by RawAlex at Jan 21 2004, 04:11 PM

Exactly which god was that that bestowed these rights ?

Odin ?
Zeus ?
Apollo ?
The Earth Mother ?
Allah ?
Buddah ?
Yahweh ?

Oh I'm sorry, I am not thinking, it must be the one true god, the CHRISTIAN god.

I am sorry but ones argument loses ALL merit once god is brought into the picture, everything the human race currently knows about god has been twisted and perverted by power hungry MEN for so long that it has no semblence to reality.

For Christ's sake people (pun VERY intended) the Earth is over 4 billion years old, chistianity a little more tha 2000, how can anyone with an IQ over 12 use what they learned in Sunday School as a child a basis for anything.

Sing with me

Yes Jesus Loves Me
Yes Jesus Loves Me
Yes Jesus Loves Me
The Bible Tells Me So

I watched part of the annual US pep rally, what a fucking idiot we have for a president

Its like giving a bunch of chimps a box of hammers and a bag of angel dust.

This thread is such a theological clusterfuck I honestly cannot tell if its Oprano equivalent of the Phil Hendrie Show or the glaringly obvious.

Everyone should know that Yoda is the only true good.

But then who created Yoda?

Well George Lucas created Yoda. OMG this must mean that George Lucas is really the true God!!!

See religious beliefs do make complete sense.

This HAS to be a pearl

please explain this...

so what previous people's knew was "reality" - at what point did power/twisting, diminish this reality...and what was this reality in the first place? How do you know it's lost semblence to reality now unless you know what it was before?

when exactly was this reality..."pure" and unadulterated and how does mentioning a belief in a divine hinder a position anymore than mentioning any other belief...the world is billions of years old - how do you "know" this...read it somewhere - someone tell you - a lot of people "believe" it?

best of luck -
aeon